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The Facts About The Savings Guarantee

Published 29 September 2008 in Grow your wealth

The Fool still receives lots of comments and queries about the compensation they’ll receive if they have savings or other products with a bank that fails. We clear up the myths.

On October 3rd, the Financial Services Authority announced that the maximum compensation offered by the FSCS will rise from £35,000 to £50,000 from October 7th. In every other respect, this article remains accurate. Just substitute £50,000 for £35,000.

You will surely by now have heard about the Financial Services Compensation Scheme (FSCS). When a bank fails, this protects up to £35,000 of your savings. However, we get a lot of questions about the detail of the scheme. Here are the answers:

Does the FSCS cover all £35k of my savings?

Yes. Previously, the FSCS covered just a percentage of the first £35,000 you had in an account with a failed bank, so that you’d get back £31,700 of your £35,000. This has caused some confusion. However, the good news is that every penny of your first £35,000 is now covered by the scheme.

Does the scheme cover savings interest I’ve earned?

Yes. Not only are your savings deposits protected, but any interest you’ve earned right up to the point the bank was liquidated is protected too.

Do I get double the protection if I have two accounts with the same bank?

No. You only get £35k protection in total from the same bank.

Am I covered twice if I have two accounts within the same banking group?

It depends. Some banks are connected; for example, HSBC owns First Direct. If you have savings in both these banks you’re protected on up to £35,000 of the total. That’s because these banks share the same banking licence.

However, Royal Bank of Scotland owns NatWest, but these banks have separate licences. Therefore you could have £35,000 in both banks (£70,000 in total) and the whole lot is protected.

(Note that if you had savings in Bradford & Bingley these will now be moved to Abbey. Donna Werbner has written today about what this means for you if you have savings in either or both banks.)

Read more about Which Banks Are Connected.

My bank’s foreign. Do I get the same protection?

Yes. If the bank trades here, it must have a banking licence, which means your savings are still protected by the scheme. However, sometimes your savings are covered in part by a foreign scheme as well. This means that you may be expected to try to claim with the foreign compensation scheme first. You can then recover whatever is outstanding of the £35,000 by claiming through the FSCS. Of course, it’s possible this might delay your compensation.

What happens to my mortgage?

Your mortgage will end up being passed to someone else to look after. It may be the Government or, much more likely, another bank. You will continue to pay your mortgage under the same terms and conditions as before.

What if I had savings and a mortgage?

If you owed, say, £200,000 to the failed company, perhaps through a mortgage, and you had £150,000 in savings, it’s likely the FSCS administrators will deduct your savings from the mortgage so that you now owe it £50,000. You’d get no compensation.

Are my pension schemes, insurance products and investments protected?

Thank you to Jane Baker, who wrote this timely piece that answers these questions: Is Your Pension Safe?

Are my offshore savings protected?

The scheme doesn’t cover the Channel Islands or the Isle of Man, nor does it cover deposits outside the European Economic Area.

Do we get twice the protection in our joint savings account?

Yes. Joint account holders will usually both benefit from £35,000 of protection, making a total of £70,000. If the FSCS’s administrators see evidence that the pot isn’t evenly split, it’s possible that one of you will receive less than £35k. This event is unlikely though, and it would only likely happen if the FSCS was handed evidence that one of you had individual savings of less than £35k.

How fast does the FSCS pay out?

There’s no fixed time in which the FSCS pays out. However, I’ve taken a look (admittedly a brief one) at a few cases and found that most people seem to have got their money in a reasonable time in the past. From the date of your claim it may be just a few weeks. But we don't know for sure how long it would take with a bigger bank.

Sometimes, as with Bradford & Bingley, alternative solutions are found immediately, so that you shouldn’t have trouble accessing your savings.

If you’ve ever claimed with the FSCS, please let us know your about your experience by writing a comment below.

How is the FSCS funded?

The banking industry ultimately funds the scheme although, as with Bradford & Bingley, the Government sometimes pays for big claims in the short-term.

Can we trust that the scheme will pay out?

For individual reasons not everyone is happy with the award they receive from the FSCS, but will the scheme fail on a massive scale? It depends how cynical you are and what state you think the country is in. Is it total Armageddon for the United Kingdom as we know it? I think not, but I’m sure some of you will share your alternative views below!

More: Four Steps To Protect Your Portfolio From The Financial Crisis

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Comments

peepobaby said

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Its a worthless guarantee since it was not even reliable enough to cover Bradford & Bingley savings.

montimar39 said

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There is no mention of any compensation if your Self Select ISA provider goes bust.
Are my Investments ring fenced or do I lose everything?

4letterman said

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Warning.Irish banks 100,000 euro cover may not extend to U.K customers.See This is money web site.

TMFArkle said

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Hi Peepobaby,

You say: 'It's a worthless guarantee since it was not even reliable enough to cover Bradford & Bingley savings.'

This isn't true. We didn't get to the stage where savers would have had to claim from the FSCS with B and B.

That's because the FSCS facilitated the sale of the savings business to Abbey/Santander. Had Santander not been willing to buy B & B, the next step would have been for the government to nationalise the savings side of the business as happened with Northern Rock.

If there had been no nationalisation or sale of B and B, we would then have been in a situation where savers would have had to submit claims to the FSCS to get their money back. I'm 100% confident that savers would have got their money back in those circumstances although they might have had to wait a few months.

Ed

peepobaby said

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Ed, I'm 100% certain that the FSCS was triggered in this case and you will find this in the Treasury release on the matter. There was absolutely no appetite or even cash funds in the UK banks to payout against the FSCS guarantee, which is the basis of my point. No member bank offered or was in a position to offer funds towards the guarantee. The government was forced to extend loans and the B&B mortgage book was purchased for £4bn. An amazing price for taxpayers to pay, despite all the assurances about the taxpayer not being exposed - simply a copy of the line used for the US Bill which has been voted down.

tre1123 said

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Can you please clarify the point about savings interest. I understood that the total amount of savings and interest cannot exceed £35k. For example, if I invest £35k in a bank which goes bust in six months time, then I will lose any interest earned on that "maximum" investment rather than being able to claim the original £35k plus, say. £1100.00 interest.

spudmccabe said

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Does anyone know if the £35k guarantee covers business account deposits?

peepobaby said

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Savings and interest are protected up to the £35,000 limit. Any interest earned over the £35,000 limit is not protected under the guarantee.

spudmccabe said

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cheers Peepobaby - that's good news

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How are estates in administration affected? i.e. is the savings protection only for the living?

CSM1971 said

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I have a couple of questions


1) After the takeover of HBOS by Lloyds, did HBOS's licescne come under Lloyds or are they separate like Royal Bank of Scotland owns NatWest? The reason I ask this I have an account with well the old Halifax and I want to be on the books of Lloyds for some extra safety.


2) I have a Cash ISA with Halifax as well I that at any kind of risk, technically this should be well an escrow account but not too sure.

Mike475 said

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Motley Fool have from time to time recommended Kaupthing Edge and ICICI as "safe" minders for cash deposits. Do you experts out there still believe this to be true?

kujar said

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What if I have £35,000 in two unconnected financial institutions and they both fail roughly at the same time. Do I still get my money from both institutions?

jimat38 said

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What constitutes a High Street Bank? I have savings and an ISA with Egg. Is this covered?

complyman said

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The compensation limits are set out in the Ch 10 of the Compensation Sourcebook found on the FSA website http://fsahandbook.info/FSA/html/handbook/COMP/10/2. You get £35K per institution even if both go bust. Accounts are protected for any person. A person can also be a body corporate so business accounts should also be protected up to £35K but only for small companies. Large companies are not protected. The investment limits only go to a maximum of £48000 but only the first £30000 is 100% protected and 90% of the next £20000 so stocks and shares ISAs above that limit are at risk. You have more cover with an insurance company with no upper limit but only 90% is guaranteed above £2000.

bennym27 said

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if there is £35K in a joint account and one of the joint account holders also has £35K in an individual account in the same bank, are they still protected for the total £70K?

nitnia said

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Are PIBS covered by the compensation scheme ? There are technically shares I believe, the same as the old share accounts at Building Societies.

Are former PIBS that are now loan stock in converted Building Socs covered?

Are the so called fixed term bonds covered? Here I mean the 1/2/3 etc year fixed rate deposits that are called bonds.

tappenben said

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You say that foreign banks trading in the UK are covered by the UK compensation scheme but does that only apply if your account is in the UK bank. For example I have an account with ING in Brussels and not in the UK so am I covered? By the way Belgium law has its own compensation scheme of 20,000 euros so we aren't doing so badly.

hakerite said

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Hi Mike 475

I'm with various banks at the 35K maxima including Kaupthing Edge and ICICI. Like you I've been just a little concerned, not least because the KE Libor is very high at around 13%.

I spoke yesterday direct with the FSA who assured me that KE is fully licenced and covered and full compensation would be forthcoming should they 'fall'.

Just for info, ICICI, Icesave and ING are also covered so it would seem reasonable to hang on in there. To find who's not you can access www.fscs.gov and navigate to the list of those 'not paid up'.

If things get really bad I might just fill the old tin up under the floorboards.

Reay123 said

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Like Mike457, I would also like to know if Kaupthing Edge are no longer considered safe, particularly as they have been removed from the Fool's list of recommended savings accounts.

Ishminds said

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Hi I have a mortgage with IF.com. I also have more than enough savings with IF.com to pay it off but as it is offset I pay no interest. The rate is very good and I do not wish to really redeem it if possible. However would my savings only be covered to £35K and the rest lost leaving me with a £120K mortgage outstanding?

Worried of Neasden!

actiondan said

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Does anyone know how shareholdings stored in IWEB or HALIFAX sharedealing accounts would be affected by the 'unlikely' collapse of the HBOS group?

I believe (though I could be wrong), that they are registered in the name of a proxy (ie HBOS) rather than myself.

dbinnes said

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Thank you hakerite for your helpful comments regarding ICICI, Icesave etc. I am relieved to read that these banks are covered by the normal UK protection rules. However, I have read a contrary opinion to this suggesting that the key point is wether the banks are fully registered in the UK.
I have seen mentioned that it may be necessary to claim through the Icelandic authorities if they are not fully covered by the FSA. Can anyone confirm this please? (not that Iwish to doubt what hakerite has said but I do need confirmation).

complyman said

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Joint accounts are effectively held in the name of the first named account holder so you only get £35K not £70K sorry. PIBS are special subordinated shares in a building society. If the building society goes bust they will be at the bottom of the pile and could be pretty worthless. The compensation scheme does not protect ordinary share holders. Shareholders take all the risk if the company goes bust so tough luck.

Nominee accounts are held on behalf of the beneficial owner so you are the owner of the shares even if held by HBOS and ought to get them back but HBOS going down may not be as unlikely as we think. If it does go down then all these conversations are of no point as the whole economy could tip over and we'll be pushing our cash around in wheel barrows and growing our own veg to survive!

kilnfield said

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Does 'savings' include the money held in a current account? With banks offering good rates on current accounts it is easy to leave quite substantial balances when, once upon a time, you would not have done this.

actiondan said

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Thanks Complyman, that's very helpful.

I suspect you're probably right about the consequences of HBOS going bust. Let's hope it doesn't happen.

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What a load of hot air ! What a waste of time and money ! Forget about any compensation scheme. Choose the savings account which gives you the best return, whether that be capital growth or income. Ignore any £35k limit. Don't let the compensation scheme tail wag the dog. Does anyone seriously believe that the government would let a licensed bank fail ?

redechan said

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Can anyone tell me what happens to an account with Bradford & Bingley, which subsequently becomes an Abbey held account. Having an Abbey account too, does this mean that I lose one of the guarantees if Abbey (or Bank of Santander) crashes?

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Hi all.

If you want a better look at this topic, I recommend http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/savings/safe-savings. Money saving expert is also (in my opinion) a better site than the fool - any referral links (i.e. links that pay the site) are clearly marked and don't affect best-buy tables, plus they don't feel the need to bombard us every day with (often pointless & poorly researched) e-mails.

NB - I'm not affiliated with them in any way, just a happy user of their service.

Cheers,

Giles

Thursford said

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How can B&B still be advertising their savings account on TV and the Internet?

djabbott said

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The BBC is reporting that the Irish Government is now guaranteeing ALL deposits in Irish banks and all money borrowed by the banks from other financial institutions, thereby safeguarding ALL deposits, bonds and debts in six banks and building societies for two years. The banks covered are Allied Irish, Bank of Ireland, Anglo Irish Bank, Irish Life and Permanent, Irish Nationwide Building Society and the Educational Building Society.

The Irish Department of Finance confirmed that the scheme would cover all UK branches of the financial institutions, but that negotiations were under way with the British authorities on safeguards that might be provided to any of the six banks' subsidiary companies in the UK. Another bit of pressure on Brown/Darling?

For those persons blessed with deposits above £35k surely the Irish Banks have become an obviously safe house, providing the interest rates stay competitive? Will The Fool catch on, even without getting a rake-off?

johne103 said

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Invest in a gold wheelbarrow.

jimat38 said

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Thanks Sandspider, I got the answer to my question at moneyexpert.
Looks like an excellent site for the innocents like me.
No smart-asses!

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I find it strange that there's no mention of the estimated $60 trillion of over the counter OTC credit default swaps (CDS) that is now imploding and about to get a whole lot worse. I say estimated because of the very nature of these financial instruments. No one knows the true value, these private deals were done between financial instituitions. There is no exchange for them and no regulation. The lengendary investor Warren Buffet described these as "financial waepons of mass destruction".
To simplify CDS, they are basically insurance polices offered and taken out by financial insitituitions designed to pay out if the money they loaned out is defaulted upon. The majority of the loan money is tied up in the alpha bet soup of securitised debt e.g MBS (mortgage backed securities) CDO's (collateralised debt obligatins)etc many of which are dependant upon among other things people not defaulting on their mortgages etc. Now we all know what's happening in the USA and now aslo in the UK. Add to this the leveraging up (borrrowing) of often 30 to 1 in some cases and I'm sure you get the picture. Even if the $700 billion dollar bailout does get approved it will only control the global crash which I expect to wipe out most of the western worlds banks.
What you have to ask yourselves is:
1)Do you want to be in the government bailout queque with millions of others. A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.
2) If I'm correct the FSCS has about £5 million in it's coffers at the moment, there's estimated to be £6 trillion in savers deposits in the UK. How and where are the government going to get most of this money from?

Good luck

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goodtyneguy - I think your last comment is one everyone relying on the 35k guarantee should consider. I called the FSCS yesterday and went round their telephone system for 15 mins of automated voices before getting a human. Imagine what it will be like if they start getting volume claims. Add to that the efficiency of the "bust" bank in providing info on the depositors. If your with ICICI you may as well forget it (took me 6 weeks to get them to send a CHAPS from my Isave account (now firmly closed). Also note that Moodys rate the Icelandic Banking system as fragile and although Kauthing Edge has the 35k guarantee, the bank behind Icesave apparently has a partial guarantee with the "top up" claims being dealt with in Iceland.
Yesterday HBOS share price was 15% down at one point so clearly the City isn't certain the HBOS /Lloyds rescue will go through (I have cleared out deposit that exceed my mortgage on my IF offset account). I here (Radio 4 last Sat) in '74 city folk were burying krugerands in their gardens. Happily were not at that point but the A+ banks look like the place to be - which is why they can pay lower rates (don't let your greed lose you your capital).

johnlad6 said

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in the hypothetical situation of the hbos - lloyds merger NOT passing , does that mean that everything above the 35000 is immediately lost ? or would hbos not be regarded as " bust "

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ArtemisFowl said " I here (Radio 4 last Sat) in '74 city folk were burying krugerands in their gardens."

These times will return, in fact it's building up to that now. Gold production has shrank since 74 and the worlds money supply has grown exponentially. The informed are buying up gold like there's no tomorrow. Refiners and mints cannot keep up with demand. Just try and buy gold and silver coins from any of the bullion dealers. Those that do have stock are asking premium prices of in some cases 50% above spot and they are still selling.

Remember gold in ones possession has no counterparty risk, very, very important in this climate. In my opinion it will be the only reliable store of value as the central banks continue flooding the world with paper money to support the global insolvent banking system. A hyperinflationary environment is a distinct possibility and under these circumstances savings, investments and pensions etc in whatever currencies will become worthless. Think Weimar Germany and Zimbabwe.

Those that protect themselves now will avoid insolvency, and not only protect their wealth but profit immensely when gold returns to it's true free market value.

bills01 said

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I'm an Aussie with a Halifax Gold 1 year term deposit. Now HBOS seems to be merging with Lloyds TSB, how will that affect my Halifax account.
Is Halifax Bank still trading and as I'm not a UK resident would I be covered for the compensation scheme?

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The UK government will not allow these heavy weights to go down. You should still be covered as an aussie. The thing you should be concerned with is the currency risk. The GBP is tanking, you'd but much better off with the Aussie dollar.

Jezza said

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I am a US resident - but a UK citizen, are my UK bank deposits covered by the scheme even though I no longer live in the UK?

Shuggster said

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Dear Eager Savers, Lords of their Finances, Fellow Fools

After reading rather disturbing comments on the state of the economy and a rather unusual lack of confidence we have in our financially able colleagues at FCSA, I wish to ask you young Sirs and Madams, what would you do if you were in charge of UK economy?
I am sure that I am going to receive a barrage of comments which are clearly based on hindsight, a very useful tool that most of those who run UK Plc could have done with too. Unfortunately they did not have it neither did you then. Now I am normally one stands for none other than myself, so I see this as a great buying opportunity. Yes, I am possibly going to make an initial loss but I am in here for the long term.
Naturally you are worried about the £35,000 (or £50,000) limit because you have that kind of money, if not much much more. So either buy gold like a foolish (yes, with a simple f) colleague suggested or buy buy buy. Buy the things that are now cheaper than they were before due to people having less disposable income, but you clearly do. Prices all LUXURY items are coming down, invest in these which will go back up in value and avoid ones that depreciate.
Buy that flat in Spain which has been reduced by 20% to shift it, you have the money. Buy the second home as an investment especially in a University city as more unemployed people are “upgrading” their skills and they need accommodation and bingo.
Buy that second hand car from that ex-banker, he had dealt with the devaluation of not just his car, but where money is king, so are you.
Finally I would like to say I believe we will come out of the credit crunch squeaky clear just like a 2nd hand car out of a car wash.

Good Luck,

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If everything goes "belly up" then inflation will rocket upwards and your money will be as worthless as Zimbabwee or other countries during the second world war, so the "safeguards of £35,000/£50,000 won't matter at all and as other writers have mentioned, even getting hold of anyone on the phone will be impossible. The only way to avoid this is for people not to panic - a difficult thing to do when your bank is under threat - I know because I have money with HBOS. Yes the banks have been entirely stupid but it is no good compounding their stupidity by making a run on the banks. By all means buy the goods you always intended to buy, but if everything goes wrong at least we will all be in the same boat (penniless) -and we will get a good feeling from knowing that those who made millions talking down the HBOS shares only to buy them back again cheaply will also have worthless money/shares. We also might re-gain some of the community spirit that I understand (I was born after the war) existed during the second World War and although times were hard then, there always seemed to be a good theatre show to go to or a dance in the NAAFI canteen and people did seem to smile much more that they do nowadays. Time to go to the pub I think!

38kopoba49 said

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The Government are guaranteeing up to £35,000 per person in each bank, and not each account. This is to be raised to £50,000 in a few days. I can understand that, but what is the position of Charities, or Charitable Institutions?

wdaviesuk said

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complyman

Above you say "Joint accounts are effectively held in the name of the first named account holder so you only get £35K not £70K sorry."

Yet the Fool guide at the top of the page states that joint account holders each benefit from the guarantee effectively doubling the amount.

The FSCS also states "The new limit will apply to each depositor for the total of deposits they hold with an organisation regardless of how many accounts they hold or whether they are a single or joint account holder. In the case of a joint account, FSCS will assume that the money in the account is split equally between account holders, unless evidence shows otherwise."

nikkilocke said

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Dear Shuggster,
Buying a flat in Spain is not a good long-term investment. Once people realise how bad global warming is going to get, they will lose interest in owning property in an area that will probably become a desert. The loss of confidence (and consequent drop in price) will happen long before any actual desertification.

LynnyH said

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I'm new to this so hope this is not too specific a question. My mother in law has £30,000 in a bond which is due to mature this month. If she reinvests it in another fixed term bond (she relies on the monthly interest), would it mean if the bank went belly up she would no longer get her monthly interest and she would have to wait til the end of the fixed term to claim.

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At the present time, having been brave - or foolish!, I have £50,000.00 in Birmingham Midshires I year bonds,due to mature in November and a further £10,000.00 to mature in February.
Attracted by the AA offer of 7.21% I made to invest but found that this is also with Birmingham Midshires.
Does the government guarantee extend to both BM and AA?

paw5686 said

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Can you tell me if an investment is safe in the Investec Global Strategy Fund. It is invested in their sub fund, the Global Bond Fund. If the company Investec were to fail would the units in this bond fund still be safe? I realise hte value of the units go up and down with the market.

Alternatively what would be the position if I were to hold units in their cash or deposit fund. Does the £50k gaurantee rule then apply. The company was registered in the Channel Isles but now registered in Luxembourg.

Rotherwick said

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Can I get this straight ? Does the FSCS scheme offer £ 50,000 compensation each to holders of joint bank accoiunts ? Thanks.
Rotherwick.

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