Give Yourself The Mother Of All Pay Rises

Bruce Jackson
by Lovemoney Staff Bruce Jackson on 16 January 2009  |  Comments 42 comments

With the base rate at just 1.5%, thousands of mortgage holders are suddenly finding themselves flush with cash. The feel good factor will return.

I have seen the light. I've been searching for all of a day now but now I can see it. There is a light at the end of the economic tunnel.

Just yesterday I wrote about The Grim Reality Of 2009. Jobs were being slashed across the globe. World stock markets were on the slide. Just about everyone now, except perhaps George W Bush, admits this is going to be a long and deep recession.

Obviously nothing has changed between yesterday and today. In fact, in the last 24 hours, more people lost their jobs and the FTSE 100 lost yet another 60 points.

Hope You Can Believe In

For me, the thing that changed is hope. Perhaps not quite in the same way that Barack Obama brings hope to millions of Americans, but hope nevertheless. Hope breeds optimism. It brings back the feel good factor. The glass is half full rather than half empty.

Before I go on, let me say I'm the first to admit this whole global financial crisis has sent me into a spin. Some days I'm more optimistic than others. I'm finding those days are usually when my share portfolio rises. I know that is wrong, but when your portfolio has been hammered mercilessly over the past year, up days deserve some sort of mini-celebration, don't you think?

So why the optimism today?

Mother Of A Pay Rise

I found this post by `bingcrosby' on The Motley Fool's very popular Paulypilot's Pub discussion board very uplifting. As you can see, his fixed rate mortgage deal has just come to an end, and he is Foolishly in the process of checking out what other deals are available out there in mortgage-land.

To `bingcrosby's' surprise, despite the prevailing doom and gloom, he found there was a decent selection of deals in the marketplace. He also found his current mortgage provider's standard variable rate was just 3.49%.

In his words."I did the sums and nearly fell off the seat.Our disposable income is about to double. Bear in mind we are two professionals with 3 kids and a hefty mortgage.this is similar to getting the mother of all pay rises and bonus put together and then some."

It's Exactly Why The Base Rate Is At 1.5%

Now think about what this type of `pay rise' might mean for the economy if it is replicated over the tens of thousands of households with standard variable mortgages. Suddenly, there is a lot more cash sloshing about the economy. There are lots more people feeling optimistic than pessimistic.

Now before I get too excited, the whole point of slashing base interest rates to 1.5% is because we are in a recession. Just because people like `bingcrosby' have doubled their disposable income, it doesn't mean the recession is over.

Being a double income professional family, the `bingcrosbys' are more likely to be offered an attractive mortgage rate of 3.49% than an unemployed single mother living in an ex-Council estate. Sadly, people like that will continue on Struggle Street - life is sometimes not fair like that. But there is no doubt many people are set to benefit from the slashing of the base rate to the lowest level on record.

The Return Of The Feel Good Factor

It doesn't take too big a leap of faith to see how the economy might start recovering towards the back end of 2009 and early 2010. Tens of thousands of home owners will find themselves flush with cash as mortgage rates tumble. Initially, some will save most of the `windfall'. Some will pay off their mortgage that bit faster. Some will spend it.

As time goes on, and people feel a little more secure in their jobs, the spending will increase. It's natural. I do it. You do it. We all do it. It's called the feel-good factor.

Right now, for many people, the feel good factor is about as far away as peace in the Middle East. But unlike the latter, as time goes by, it will return. The economy doesn't turn around on a sixpence. It will take 9 to 12 months, at a minimum, perhaps even a little more, and then it won't necessarily be a sharp recovery. But beggars can't be choosers, and stating the obvious, a small recovery is better than continued recession

There is a light. `bingcrosby' is living proof the light does exist. We've just got to get through the next 12 - 24 months unscathed, or as unscathed as possible. Good luck.

P.S. Now might be a great time to check out just how low you can get your mortgage rate. Try the Motley Fool's no-fee mortgage service for starters. All you've got to lose is your existing high mortgage rate.

P.P.S. I fully realise all this extra money sloshing around the economy could mean today's era of deflation is relaced by tomorrow's period of inflation. But that's a story for another day, and another fight.

More: Naive 20-Year Olds Make The Best Investors | The Grim Reality Of 2009

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Comments (42)

  • deadestfish
    Love rating 0
    deadestfish said

    This article sounds dangerously close to saying that the Government and/ or the BoE Monetary Policy Commitee have got something right in response to the financial crisis?

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  • richardcgnfc
    Love rating 0
    richardcgnfc said

    This is also relevant to me. My fixed rate of 5.24% comes to an end next month but the SVR is now at 5% and set to go lower so a little saving there. Prob is i could not shop around as my LTV is at 103%!! So if it wasnt for this id be stuffed. I am now overpaying and aiming to reduce my LTV for when the rates start going up again. Still hard work for me!!

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  • castath
    Love rating 0
    castath said

    I think your P.P.S. is the most important point in this article and something people currently remortgaging should seriously consider. If your LTV is continually decreasing then you will have less choice in the mortgage market should interest rates move against you.

    Also, we aren't currently experiencing deflation, what we are experiencing is known as disinflation. Now like everyone else I don't believe the creativeness of this Governments figures but since general deflation has not been called, it would be wrong to say otherwise.

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  • jonesjeff
    Love rating 0
    jonesjeff said

    All the government is doing is encouraging consumer spending, which mostly goes on imported goods & gets the UK further into debt.

    As long as we run an excessive balance of trade deficit, this has to be financed by loans from abroad & selling UK assets.

    The UK needs more manufacturing, as that's the only thing that could close up that unsustainable trade deficit. To achieve this, we need lower taxes on employment, industrial buildings etc. Then less red tape. Also, we must stop giving the likes of China free access to our markets, when they are sticking 33% tariffs on anything we try to export over there.

    To all the MPs, journalists etc who have missed this, wake up & smell the coffee!

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  • Cliff D'Arcy
    Love rating 26
    Cliff D'Arcy said

    Bruce, have you developed some form of bipolar disorder when it comes to writing articles? Only you're all doom and gloom one day, then elated the next! ;0)

    All the best,

    Cliff

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  • gooseberryfuel
    Love rating 1
    gooseberryfuel said

    Hmm, so my mortgage payment decreasing but my fuel bill increase (which has doubled) will not quite balance each other out. Do I still have that feel good feeling?

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  • nlyon1
    Love rating 0
    nlyon1 said

    I remember shopping around for my mortgage 3 years ago and looking at 2 and 3 year deals, they all had 250 pound + arrangement fees, at the time this wiped out the savings on the rates, so I ended up with a Abbey lifetime tracker at +0.49 above the base rate. There was a bit of discomfort as interest rates went up for a while and looked like they could go much higher. But as arrangement fees have gone up by about 4 times and as the base rate has dropped so much this is looking like the best choice I could have made.

    Even better, it has no tie in, so if something better does come along I can look at that too.

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  • wackywitchsue
    Love rating 0
    wackywitchsue said

    Oh what joy - something positive to read - bipolar disorder or not Cliff, it really is refreshing.

    Re UK manufacturing - whoopee in an ideal world, maybe for the medium-long term future, but over the next 12-24 months I doubt it. But we do have UK owned service industries and small business by the bucket load, admittedly under enormous pressure right now, but all the more reason to spend what we do have with them. Maybe UK holidays and short breaks could be a starting point??? Will certainly help with the feel good factor if nothing else!

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  • Fingered
    Love rating 0
    Fingered said

    Bruce,

    Sorry to disllusion you but it's mass public emotion that drives markets ( your portfolio and everyone else's ) up and down not the other way around.

    I predict you are going to be unhappy again as the light at the end of the tunnel you are seeing now is simply another train coming.

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  • BT105
    Love rating 0
    BT105 said

    As someone who was made redundant at 60 and take forced early retirement, I have to rely on the interest on my savings to top up my company Pension. This has dropped by approx. £450 a month. So its not good for everyone. All those people who find themselves with big rise in their disposable income should think themselves very lucky, my income has dropped considerably, and I am now having to draw on my capital, further reducing my interest. Its people like me who are helping to fund the reduction in Mortgage interest rates to our own detriment.

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  • prwatts
    Love rating 0
    prwatts said

    The 1.5% BoE Rate is irellevant unless you are lucky enough to have a Tracker Mortgage. Everyone else suffers. The banks have to get their cash up quickly, they are not going to benignly lower our rates. My SVR mortage rate is over 3X the BoE rate. All it does is angers me. To say money is sloshing around is ridiculous - any small reductions the majority of us get are swallowed up in the past year's huge rises in energy and general living costs and anyone with sense will try and bring his LTV Rate down. Most peoples's negotiating power has gone simply because their house is worth much less. Last year mine was 60% now it's 85% This is a typical silly sensationalist article of no real use to a thinking person, which is what this website is supposed to be for.

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  • Nickipenaluna
    Love rating 1
    Nickipenaluna said

    Me too BT105, my income has dropped by about the same amount. Will benefits bail me out when all my savings have gone paying for higher fuel bills and the like? No not at all, my pension that I worked so hard for takes me just above the benefit thresh hold. Those around me who did nothing to provde for themselves are so much better off with all their government allowances.

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  • Mog101UK
    Love rating 0
    Mog101UK said

    With some analysts estimating that the current government interventions will cost an additional £15k in taxes per year on a £100k salary I'm wondering how long that feel good factor will last.

    When you also consider that with the vast amount of money being pumped into the system, at some point high inflation is likely to return with a vengeance....

    Personally, with the spare firepower from the Mortgage rate reductions I am using the opportunity to reduce the size of the mortgage to mitigage the risk that interest rates are forced to rocket in a couple of years to contain runaway inflation. I believe the last time that happened UK interest rates peaked briefly at about 14%? I know that I for one would struggle to cover an increased tax burden and the increased mortgage payments if that were to happen.

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  • PaulOz
    Love rating 0
    PaulOz said

    Couldnt agree more. The recession will only get you down if you let it - ignore it and push on!

    I'm a big fan of driving towards earning more instead of spending less.... its a much more positive approach I think.

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  • pdcovers
    Love rating 1
    pdcovers said

    Priority 1. Reduce your debts (starting with the mortgage).

    Priority 2. Make increased provision for retirement.

    Then, and only then, treat it as a pay increase.

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  • blackcatford
    Love rating 0
    blackcatford said

    The article appears to indicate the recession will begin to end in 9 to 12 months time. I doubt it. If you are lucky enough to find yourself in a similar position to bingcrosby you should seriously consider using any spare cash to pay off the mortgage. There will come a time in the future when interest rates start to rise again - you will need to protect your LTV (house prices falling will not help this) ratio as you will no doubt need to renegotiate a new deal when the time comes.

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  • Alice47
    Love rating 0
    Alice47 said

    As a pensioner, I am sure I speak for the millions of us who watch the help being given to those with mortgages, some of whom have stretched themselves beyond what is sensible. I worked all my life, saving for "my old age".

    Now I have reached that time in my life when I was hoping to be able to live off the interest from my savings that I have accumulated through hard work and not putting myself into debt by living within my means but this is now impossible. Interest rates at virtually zero, unless you want your money tied up for long periods, I have to keep my money in an easy access account because I can't use the interest to supplement the measly pension the goverment pay me, as I am having to use the capital as well to live on now.

    Also, I was keeping my few shares in one of the banks that have gone to the wall, with the idea of using them as some point to "treat myself".

    Why all this emphasis on the "spenders" in this country. I have had to be careful to eek out the pension, before all this "credit crunch", not spending unless I needed to, and won't be spending in the future unless for essentials, so I wont be contributing in helping get the economy moving, if "they" are relying on me.

    It seems to me that if you are in debt - brought on by your own actions you get a lot more help than if you have been careful with your money.

    Why should I have to go back to work because I can't live on my pension? I have worked all my life and paid a full stamp but it looks like I will be looking for work again in the near future.

    It has been suggested that the government can remove tax to basic tax payers on sayings, yes that would help but with interests rates so low, wouldn't make a lot a difference but every little would help.

    I am not a professor or have a vast amount of experience in finances but am sure I could have made some better decisions on monetary matters, than our current government eg. removal of 10% tax band springs to mind.

    I rest my case!

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  • bojotools
    Love rating 1
    bojotools said

    People are still buying the things they actually need. Houses were grossly overpriced and money was in the system purely based on inflated asset values. The world won't come to an end if people can't buy Jaguars and Range Rovers and Wedgewood was hardly an essential at the dinner table. Luxury goods should have punitive taxes and VAT should be abolished on essentials where possible. Until we have an equitable tax system and a sensible attitude to consumerism there will always be boom and bust cycles. If we stop whining and get on with living within our means our economy will soon get back on a more even keel.

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  • joannakd
    Love rating 9
    joannakd said

    Well !

    I have saved about £350/mth since the rates started dropping....and I thought "whoppee", I can buy some new furniture with the savings...

    However, before I went out to the sales this year, my car needed a new battery (£75), then I need to call a plumber out for a boiler repair (£100), now I need to pay £500 for my contents insurance excess as a water leak has ruined my whole ground floor.

    So there go my savings !

    So whilst Mr Brown wants us to spend, and the economy needs it, we have to think about priorities at home first, as Mr Brown will not help the individual.

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  • laalaa41
    Love rating 3
    laalaa41 said

    VAT should never have been applied for individuals like heat, light, communications (phone in case of emergency) and certain things we need from pharmacies. I mean they called it "luxury tax" in the beginning didnt they?

    I suppose they had to keep taxing us to the hilt to pay for their freebies.

    I remember something about a third world country where their government tried to tax the rain - werent there big riots? We can't protest here any more because all the police is do is corner people for 10 hours - Oxford Street wasn't it?

    L

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  • varmatyr
    Love rating 3
    varmatyr said

    As a saver whose total income has fallen by more than 15% over the last few months I can't help feeling that the banks are stealing my money and giving it mortgage borrowers. So you'll have to forgive me if I don't share your joy.

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  • ronat42
    Love rating 62
    ronat42 said

    I relate particularly to Alice47. I also rely on my savings interest as my pension has also been hit by the present financial mess. My savings were accumulated while paying off morgage rates frequently well into double figures and I am also on of themany who are still out of pocket because of the 10% fiasco.

    However, I congratulate all of those who are better off because of the mortgage rate decrease, I only hope that they will spend their surplus on British goods and services, if they can find any!.

    Finally, as a sufferer of the Equitable life fiasco, I was interested to note that the recent estimates are that it would cost the government £4B to partially compensate the victims as opposed to only £1.5 at the time. Also, It cost them (us) £7B to patially rectify the self inflicted mess over the 10% tax error, most of which went to people who were not losers while we who were the real victims only got about half back.

    Working on percentages, mortgage payers can get about a 50% reduction in payments, whereas the savers who make it possible have suffered between 75% and 95% reductions.

    What a cock up!

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  • flatmonkey
    Love rating 0
    flatmonkey said

    We, too, are benefiting from the drop in interest rate - in January last year our mortgage provider gave us a tracker with an interest rate of 0.39% above the base rate with no collar or tie (-in).

    This is our first home so our LTV was quite high; we're using this break to do up the flat and overpay as much as we can at the moment.

    But we're also of the generation who have struggled to get this far - we have no pensions, and now no savings (after pooling those to put down a deposit on our home to get the decent interest rate).

    It's lucky the mortgage payments are quite low as we don't know if our jobs are safe anyway!

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  • DrWealth
    Love rating 0
    DrWealth said

    I am also in the position of trying to rely on savings after getting made redundant from a sector rapidly moving wholesale to India and China.

    Actually I thought there were very few people in real danger of losing their homes with interest rates at 5% - the majority just feeling a rather big pinch! And all of them too late to the housing market if they bought in the last 5 years. I guess the wider economy and business need lower rates for now...

    ...but I wonder what would happen if ALL us savers decided - this week - to go en masse to our banks and withdraw the lot! Perhaps the banks that survived would give us a better deal.

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  • 0scarD
    Love rating 0
    0scarD said

    Regarding the "GOOD NEWS" of interest rate cuts for mortgage holders - no one seems to give a thought for all the unfortunate people in my position. Sadly I was conned into taking an endowment mortgage 20 years ago. A few years ago I was told that my endowment will have a huge shortfall. I was not in the position to switch to a repayment mortgage because I was unable to work due to ill health. Therefore, I still have an endowment mortgage and the shortfall will be even bigger because of the cut in interest rates. It is not just the savers who will suffer due to this fall in rates. My husband is in his 70s and I in my 60s - and in 5 years when my endowment matures and my mortgage is due to be paid off, we shall lose our home because we will be unable to pay the £52,000 we owe on the mortgage.

    Isn't it about time the government thought about EVERYONE before they act and make special provision oifr those who will lost out? The wealthy people who have larger mortgages are the ones who will gain the most; pensioners always lose out!

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  • BigScaryHaynet
    Love rating 0
    BigScaryHaynet said

    Come on Bruce, you are falling for the smoke and mirror tricks.

    If interest rates go down this is simply moving money around, not doing anything to create anything. There are "minuses" to exactly match the "plus". OK, so people will have more to spend (Mainly on cars, televisions, computers, washing machines, etc. all from abroad, on holidays abroad? So we provide employment abroad, and foreigners can use the money we pay them to buy up the wealth producing sector of the UK. Brilliant!)) But now the mortgage providers and industry financiers have less income, so cannot finance industry. In addition they turn to the taxpayers, via the government, to make up the shortfall.

    Gordon Brown often used the word "prudence" to camourflage his actual actions? He is, and always has been, a huge liability.

    It will all end in tears.

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  • bojotools
    Love rating 1
    bojotools said

    People quickly forgot that under Labour VAT was introduced at 25% luxury rate and 8% on everything else. Labour politicians still go on about the Tories hiking tax from 8% to 15% but fail to mention that their own 'luxury' tax had decimated many industries.

    I believe that the rates of duty on fuel are sufficiently punitive on thirsty vehicles so increased Road Tax rates are just a ruse and have no true bearing on desires to reduce emissions. There definitely should be luxury registration tax on new vehicles based on a calculation of use, longevity and emissions.

    Government uses illogical and downright deceitful means to raise revenue instead of applying common sense measures which all will admit to being fair.

    A 25% luxury tax on a Plasma Screen TV which is now a third of the price it was a couple of years ago would hardly be an injustice. The reduction of VAT on a blanket basis was about as stupid a thing as the great moron Gordon could have come up with.

    Gordon Brown is to prudence what Vlad the Impaler was to acupuncture.

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  • pensview
    Love rating 0
    pensview said

    In response to Alice47

    "Saving for my old age - living off the interest" you knew you were going to retire then, why didn't you put the money in to a pension fund that would have qualified for tax relief at what ever it was at the time and 3-5 years prior to retirement keep a close eye on the funds you were invested in and move when the fund value was high to a cash deposit within yourpension and then purchase a pension with a guaranteed annual income for life when you retired? I can't understand anyone just "saving" - you don't have to be rich to have a pension plan and everyone gets the tax benefit. Retirement is almost a sure thing - (provided you reach it) you will retire. So to say you saved all your life - why didn't your get any advice?

    Sorry to sound hard by only the exceedingly rich should ever consider retiring on their savings.It would seem that retiring was something you were aware off?

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  • cbf1000
    Love rating 0
    cbf1000 said

    No Mortgage, no saving.

    Intrest rate going down, loss of income.

    Gas & electric, going up.

    No feel good factor here.

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  • ronat42
    Love rating 62
    ronat42 said

    In response to Pensview.

    I did both, pension and savings. Thanks to to meddling and incompetance of the current government, my pension is becoming a disaster area and I don't even have control of what is left. I have calculated that I would be better off if I had put it all into savings, especially as a lower taxpayer I only get about half of the govenment subsidy as the higher tax payers. I do at least have control of my savings and can at least try to be frugal until somone with a sense of proportion gets into power.

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  • ronat42
    Love rating 62
    ronat42 said

    In response to Flatmonkey,

    I do feel for you. But we should remember that one of the reasons that you had to pay so much for your home is the artificially low interest rates that allowed speculators to push up prices. This and the rediculous policies of allowing unrealistic mortgages has been a large contributor to the current mess.

    I suppose that the old "What goes round comes round." is true again. Unfortunately the swigs are getting wider.

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  • varmatyr
    Love rating 3
    varmatyr said

    @ronat42, I completely agree. My pension fund is now worth less money than I have paid into it. I would literally have been better putting the money under my bed. One of the reasons for the property "boom" was so many people losing faith in pensions and the stock market.

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  • pensview
    Love rating 0
    pensview said

    Hi guys, you seen to be missing my point - pensions are a long term investment and you can move any money from fund to fund throughout the savings term - money can always be moved in to a cash deposit fund at any point, and yes investments go down as well as up - but if someone was due to retire in 2009 if they had have been paying attention to their pension 3-5 years ago they could have moved the money then - at a time when things were on a high - I'm just trying to say everyone is so quick to moan and so slow to get professional advice - the only true person that is going to look after your own money is yourself.

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  • fenemore
    Love rating 205
    fenemore said

    Those who claim that we need to get back to manufacturing have spotted what most politicians (all of whom have never held a proper job) have failed to see.

    We produce virtually nothing but consume just about everything in this country. Once the envy of the manufacturing world, we have become nothing more than a international joke.

    Successive governments have, piece by piece, dismantled our skills base and put everthing in the "bean-counting" basket. Yet without too much brain strain, it becomes clear that it is the "bean-counters" that have got us into this mess.

    Once our great companies were headed by great men of vision, entrepreneurs that became household names. Men & women for whom "accountants" were subservient, reporting to the main board when called to do so. Slowly over the last 30 years, as these visionaries met their makers, those dreaded "accountants" became the CEO's. People for whom the word "wisdom" remained unused in a dictionary. Planning for the future? The only plan they had or have is how to maximise their bonuses within the current financial year. They only ever worry about the next year when it had arrived.

    Every year profits had to be BIGGER than last year or the other city bean-counters would condemn it as a failure. Now that "profit" of any amount is largly fantasy for most companies - I wonder how smug those overpaid city parasites are feeling.

    Was it the late great Lord Weinstock of Marconi who said "Accountants should NEVER be allowed to run ANYTHING"? The Marconi company is no more - brought to its knees by bean-counting George Simpson and John Mayo. Marconi has become notorious as one of the worst disasters of British Corporate history - until now that is!

    A strong economy is based on manufacturing and until this is recognised and put right, we are NEVER going to get out of this mess.

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  • willywonka59
    Love rating 0
    willywonka59 said

    The current financial mess we are in is a total shambles and the banks and so-called city slickers have a lot to answer for. I worked for NatWest for 31 years up until 8 years ago and often wondered where the huge profits went as they certainly did not go to the staff. The main people who did benefit were the directors and what about those city traders receiving million pound bonuses every year purely driven by greed. If I had my way they should be rounded up at the earliest opportunity and locked up with no chance of parole! To say that the country is in a mess is the understatement of understatements. RBS shares trading at 12p, it's a joke.

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  • hakerite
    Love rating 0
    hakerite said

    Well presented Fenemore and I fully endorse your comments. However, in my view we no longer have the infrastructure or indeed culture to become a great manufacturing country again.

    Regarding the article, I break it down into two components - to have or not to have - mortgages that is.

    I have six and at one time had nine with a view to acquiring as many as possible - "never pay off your mortgage".

    With 100% tax relief, mathmatically it made sense to keep them. eg. I currently have a six figure un-collared commercial mortgage at 1% over base and open ended. With zero% being banded around it makes me feel dizzy just to think about it!

    Of course I'm referring to BTL's but the principal is the same. More money in one's pocket for existing borrowers - less for savers (I'm also one of those)

    The truth is it's an extremely complex set of issues where Einstein's action/reaction comes into play. Whoever does what in Government will have a cause and effect for good or 'evil'.

    I'm glad I'm a musician....

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  • winningd
    Love rating 0
    winningd said

    All "Savers" should vote Lib Dem at the next election. Not that they will do any better but we should severly punish Labour for the disaster they heve brought on us.

    Pensioners should form a union and use their political mussel

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  • ronat42
    Love rating 62
    ronat42 said

    Pensview,

    I accept and agree your last point. When I started my pension, 45 years ago, we could rely on the integrity of the financial system. Unfortunately, that is no longer the case and the question is "Is there anyone we can rely on?" You are right in sayng that we can only rely on ourselves. Unfortunately, unleass you have the right background an the gift of second sight, few of us can do much better.

    I realised the instability of the pension system 15 years ago and bought and refurbished just one property for rent and that is now my only reasonably safe pension provision. Again, that is only safe because, rather than borrow huge amounts, I worked about 100 hours a week for several years and I now owe nothing to anyone.

    My reflection on that is that the only way to build a secure future at any level, personal, corporate, or national, is to learn to recognise smoke and mirrors and avoid them.

    I agree with a previous correspondent who suggested that the engineers of our problems should be brought to account. They should be stripped of all assets and ridiculed - the old fashioned way!

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  • bojotools
    Love rating 1
    bojotools said

    We do actually have some great manufacturing industries in the UK and we certainly have engineers and architects at the very top of the world league. What is very wrong is that we don't consider a degree of protectionism and we allow our manufacturing plants and joint-ventures to become the poor relations of overseas owners or supposedly 'sister' companies when UK-owned subsidiaries overseas are run with a light touch. All those dollar and euro earnings are now worth considerably more, so overall it is also silly to make general statements about the decline in the pound and the effects on industry.

    I've never seen a political mussel, do they debate when you start to cook them ?

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  • hakerite
    Love rating 0
    hakerite said

    Only en-mass I believe!

    Report on 20 January 2009  |  Love thisLove  0 loves
  • subaruchick
    Love rating 1
    subaruchick said

    It's hardly surprising that so many people went into property. I am twenty years off retirement but already my faith in the pensions industry is very low. I've watched my occupational pension from a job ten years ago repeatedly mismanaged and ten years is hardly a short term view. I have little faith in it, or the private pensions (all the work of highly paid professional advisors) I hold recovering and delivering anything like a liveable amount for my retirement 20 years away. Not to mention knowing I pay a fortune in NI and will see nothing for it.

    Given that a bank was happy to lend money to buy houses at a financial level they'd refuse you if you wanted to start up a small business, if you could raise the finance it was an investment offer you wouldn't get anywhere else. In the last five years we have borrowed about 3/4 of a million pounds putting it into property. No small business start up would ever have been lent that, so it's hardly surprising that we took this option to build our own business behind the scenes. Even if the housing market is in a downturn at least in 20years we have a solid asset to sell. Given that my 25 working years so far of putting money into pensions which frankly terrify me at how poorly they've performed, I want more control over my last 25years of employment income!

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  • jal2376
    Love rating 0
    jal2376 said

    hakerite, action/reaction is not Einstein it is Newton's first principle. Einstein wrote on general and special relativity, most famously E=mc2.

    Incidentally, I am also a musician with a BTL mortgage ;-)

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