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Cut Your TV Bill By £246 a Year!

Szu Ping Chan
by Lovemoney Staff Szu Ping Chan on 10 November 2008  |  Comments 103 comments

Sky and Virgin may have kissed and made-up, but which provider is cheaper when it comes to the packages they offer? We reveal all...

Readers of my blog will know that last week, Virgin Media and Sky finally ended their 20 month subscription spat, reaching a long-awaited agreement which will see the two companies share basic channels once more from Thursday.

This is good news for consumers, many of whom were left in virtual limbo when Sky pulled the plug on channels such as Sky One last year. With the digital switchover slowly gathering pace, now could be a good time to consider your options if you feel like taking the digital plunge.

But, whether you've got your heart set on a Freeview box or are thinking about splashing out a bit more, what are your options, and which provides best value for money?

Both Sky and Virgin offer a plethora of services and choices according to your viewing habits. Here's how they shape up when it comes to comparing some of their packages:

 

What it costs

What you get

Sky Entertainment Pack

From £17 per month for one Entertainment pack, up to £22 a month for all six (each additional pack costs £1).

Choice of six Entertainment packs focusing on different types of programmes. Free Sky broadband with all packages.

Virgin M

Free with Virgin phone line (£11 a month)

Over 40 digital TV channels including Sky News, E4 and Setanta Sports News.

Sky Entertainment plus Sky Movies or Sky Sports

From £34 for Sky Movies (£17 extra on top of Entertainment pack) and £36 for Sky Sports (£19 extra).

One Entertainment pack, plus either all Sky Movie or all Sky Sports channels.

Virgin L

£9 a month. £33 with either Sky Sports or Sky Movies Collection add-on.

Over 90 digital TV channels including Sky One and Two (other options available). Sky Movies includes Sky Movies 1, 2, plus Premiere and Premiere +1. Sky Sports includes 1, 2 and 3, plus Sky Sports Xtra.

Sky All Packs

£47 a month

Sky's full service, including all six Entertainment packs, plus all Sky Movies and Sky Sports channels

Virgin XL

£45.50 a month

Virgin's full service, plus Sky Movies 1 and 2, and Sky Sports 1, 2, 3 and Xtra. XL package also includes Setanta sports channels.

As you can see from the table, there's not much between the two when it comes to price, although for the basic channels, Virgin emerges the cheaper.

There are, however a few things worth pointing out.

Although Sky and Virgin have made peace - this comes at a price. If you're a Virgin customer wanting to tune into Sky One and Two, you will need to opt for either the L or XL TV packages, which start from £9 a month.

In addition, one of the most important things to remember is that in order to take advantage of Virgin's deals, you need to take out a Virgin phone line, which costs £11 a month (although you can keep your existing phone number).

Personally, I think it's a question of quantity versus quality. In terms of channels offered, Sky gives you more channels for your money, especially when it comes to movies. However, unlike the Sky packages, where you must pay for an entertainment base pack, Virgin is a lot more flexible, giving you greater freedom to tailor your package, and at a lower price.

For example, Virgin offers Setanta Sports as standard with its XL package, which you could also opt for on its own with the free M package, costing just £12.99 per month.

Sky on the other hand requires a minimum spend of £28 a month for one Sky Sports channel and Entertainment pack (Virgin's equivalent costs £24 without Sky One and £28 with). Sky is also currently offering £15 credit when you join online.

Stay free with Freeview

If you'd prefer not to be tied to a monthly contract, you could also opt for a Freeview box for as little as £20. This one-off payment gets you 48 digital TV channels, with the comfort that you'll never have to pay a monthly subscription fee. A Foolish choice for many methinks (although you don't get Sky One with Freeview).

Alternatively, Sky also offers a `Pay Once, Watch Forever' service where for a one-off fee you can tune in to over 200 channels. The service costs £75 and you can buy a pack from Argos, Dixons and other similar retailers. The £75 payment includes the cost of a dish and installation.

Find a bargain with a bundle

If you are leaning towards Sky, one of its main perks is that all customers get free Sky broadband with its TV service.

Bundling packages in this way is quickly becoming the norm, and several providers including Sky, Virgin and even BT offer such packages, together with deep discounts and freebies in order to reel you in.

If you already pay £15 or so per month for your broadband service alone, you may want to consider taking a package like this, which for a few extra pounds per month could end up providing good value for money.

Here's a selection of some of the basic packages available:

Company and Bundle

What it costs

What you get

Tiscali TV, Broadband and Weekend Calls

£15.99 a month for 1st three months, £19.99 thereafter. Total: £19.99 per month

TV Variety pack, which includes over 70 digital TV channels, plus BT phone line rental, 8Mb broadband and free weekend UK and international calls. (One off £30 installation fee applies)

Sky See, Speak and Surf

£17 a month (BT or Sky line rental payable). Total: £27 per month (with Sky line rental)

Sky+ box (£99) with one Entertainment pack, free weekend and evening UK calls and 2Mb broadband. (One off £30 installation fee applies if not taking Sky+ box)

Virgin Telly Bundle

£19 a month with a Virgin phone line (£11 a month). Total = £30 per month

Virgin L package which includes over 90 digital TV channels, 2Mb broadband and unlimited UK weekend calls. (One off £30 installation fee applies

BT Vision Bronze

From £7 a month for 1st three months, £14 thereafter. (BT line rental and broadband required). Total = £40.49 per month

8Mb Option 1 broadband plus any two BT Vision viewing packs, including films, music and sports, plus TV pack and free Setanta Sports 1

Again, the world is your oyster when it comes to choosing your bundle, and there are several combinations available to entice you to part with your money.

Tiscali is the clear leader when it comes to the numbers alone, and offers broadband and digital television, as well as free weekend UK and international calls for just £15.99 a month for the first three months, and £19.99 thereafter. You don't even need to pay BT line rental on top of this.

In this way, you could save £246 a year by opting for Tiscali over BT (excluding introductory deals). A word of warning however. Tiscali's customer service has left a lot to be desired in the past, and any more views on this from fellow Fools would be greatly appreciated.

At the other end of the scale, if you stick with BT, its Vision service will cost you a minimum of £40 a month to get their complete service.

In fairness to BT, its most basic package offers an enhanced number of channels, including Setanta sports, and is also HD ready. In this way it could provide good value depending on what you watch.

The world of digital media is a vast one, and the different combinations available could end up leaving your head spinning. The important thing to remember is to buy a package which is tailored to your viewing habits and not pay more than you should. Personally, I think bundles are the way forward -- as long as you use all the services that is.

More: Ditch BT And Save £118 A Year / Download Free Music For A Year!

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Comments (103)

  • onlyroz
    Love rating 0
    onlyroz said

    There is also the consideration that the Virgin customer service department (inherited from NTL) is abysmal. I have been forced to take up a Virgin/NTL subscription twice in my life - after my first experience I said "never again" but then I was told that I wasn't allowed a satellite dish in my leasehold flat - so was forced to go with Virgin again. Now I'm living in a house I am extremely relieved to be back with Sky - although it took yet another 6 months to persuade Virgin to stop sending me bills and to get someone competent to actually close the account.

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  • blackwhite
    Love rating 0
    blackwhite said

    If it has any bearings, last I'd seen both BSkyB and Carphone Warehouse were bidding for Tiscali. If Sky gets it.......

    By the way, I know how to cut the TV bills even further - stick with the 5 basic channels :-)

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  • martint123
    Love rating 0
    martint123 said

    If you are leaning towards Sky, one of its main perks is that all customers get free Sky broadband with its TV service.

    Not in the Kingston/Karoo monopoly area you don't.

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  • Colonel92
    Love rating 0
    Colonel92 said

    After using BT for many years I signed up to a Tiscali package in August after moving to a new property and have to say to date I have been extremely satisfied.

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  • dundeemedia
    Love rating 0
    dundeemedia said

    Virgin customer service may be abysmal, however in the last 8 years I have only had to call them twice regarding a problem.

    Apart from a few recent problems due to building works near my house, I think the broadband has been down 4 or 5 times in this period - so which would you prefer, great customer service or service with an uptime of greater than 99.998%

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  • CamaroJace
    Love rating 0
    CamaroJace said

    Having read your article there are a few things that I'd like to add......

    I decided that as I already had 3 Virgin phone lines and Virgin Broadband that I'd go the whole hog and go with the VIP package and get the V+ HD box. You have to sign up for a year. What a let down! There is only 1 HD channel - namely BBC HD which is all previews up until late pm. The V+ box isn't even comparable to Sky+, it is slow, crashes frequently and is nowhere near as easy to use as Sky+. Sky is packed with useful features that the V+ box simply doesn't have. For example with Sky+/HD if you watched a movie then stop half way through at any time simply press the play button and it resumes from where you left off. V+ doesn't have a play button it has a play/pause button. Therefore if you want to continue to watch what you started watching say yesterday you have to go into the teadiuously slow V+ recorded menu and find the progam that you started watching and then tell it to continue to play. This makes a simple pressing of one button on Sky+ to going through 3 seperate menus and then being asked 2 questions by the V+ box - just to continue where you left off!

    I ended up paying for both Sky and Virgin last year, as I was tied into a 12 month contract with Virgin, but I really didn't want to continue with the terrible V+ product. I ended up putting Sky+ back in my lounge and put the V+ box in my office.

    In addition to the V+ box being harder and slower to use, I had Sky+ wired in so that any tv in the house could tune into it and could therefore watch a program on any television set, this is made possible because Sky have put two uhf outputs on the back of the unit. I can also change channels on the unit if I'm upstairs (even though the unit is downstairs in my lounge) because Sky have got a system that plugs into the ariel and transfers the infra-red signal via the existing tv cable and the Sky box the acts on this signal as though you had the remote right infront of it. This is a really handy feature because, if say you watched a movie in bed last night but want to watch sky news in the morning - you can without leaving your bedroom. This system also works with SkyHD in the same way.

    However, if you try to do that with Virgin media V+ box the 'magic eye' system will not work. In addition if you have V+ set up to use the HD system thorugh the HD leads, rather than through scart leads, this automatically turns the uhf output OFF on the back of the unit, whereas the Sky unit will NOT - it remains on. The downside to this is you will have to switch back and forth between HD and normal television in order to watch on mulitiple televisions.

    I could go on forever about how disppointed I am with the V+ box, as far as I'm concerned you get what you pay for ................ and Sky is well worth the few quid a month extra!

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  • Lyonnesse
    Love rating 0
    Lyonnesse said

    You say Virgin is more flexible and quote Setanta sports as an example, and that highlights exactly what is so inflexible about Virgin.

    We hate sports. We love informative channels. You can only get national geographic, history and all our other favourites in the most expensive package, so we are having to pay for 80% garbage to get the channels we want to watch.

    The sooner we can get the whole lot off the internet and get shot of these uncompetitive monopolies the better in my view

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  • starseed777
    Love rating 0
    starseed777 said

    Good news but there is one subscription that I really dislike, the TV licence, which as we all know is a vehicle to support the Beeb, and what I really really dislike are the salary/pension/expenses of these individuals who regard the BBC as their own property to be supported by the masses, They are also unlike their supporting masses immune from the current financial crises,

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  • LanceMason
    Love rating 0
    LanceMason said

    Another option?
    You mentioned FreeView, but not FreeSat.
    I have had an analogue based MediaCentre for three years, but recently invested in a new PC, new system (MediaPortal), new TV card (BlackGold) and a satellite receiver. This sounds expensive, but the entire cost (including the most expensive item: installation of the satellite) was less than £600, which is similar to what you'd spend on a year's subscription to one of the bundles described in the article.
    Now we receive FreeSat (similar to Freeview) and are slowly chopping back the hundreds of channels we receive. MediaPortal is as good as MediaCentre, but is free. I may have to upgrade my PC every few years, but the previous one lasted for three years and only needed replacing due to the motherboard not supporting the new card bus, so I expect to enjoy more channels for less money.
    If you had a £9-£47 subscription, you would spend in the region of £324-£1692 over the next three years. A little bit of effort (it took me a weekend) with setting up a cutting-edge system could save you a bundle...

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  • b11mfy
    Love rating 0
    b11mfy said

    Virgin are a total waste of time. They failed to arrive on two occasions to
    install the line from the road to my house. I was promised a free month for my troubles that took me 4 phone calls to receive. A friend of mine was due to have an installation only last week, she took the morning off to wait for the engineers who surprise, surprise never turned up. When she called to enquire why she was ask to pay £100 credit on to the account?

    AVOID VIRGIN.......

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  • ivdjugashvili
    Love rating 0
    ivdjugashvili said

    Freeview just about does it for me.

    I've tried the rest and they're just a waste of money. I recently had to get a new freeview box. I got the one with Setanta in and paid £50 in total to get the box and three months of setanta. I've watched one match so far, so it wasn't the best investment.

    Nice to see this article has attracted the usual beeb bashers. We get all the BBC channels - including world class radio channels such as R4 for less than £12 a month. Setanta costs a tenner on its own. Sky and Virgin charge a small fortune and most people end up watching the BBC and ITV. Of course the beeb bashers don't like to mention that.

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  • chrishelpmeout
    Love rating 0
    chrishelpmeout said

    Cut it even more - pull the plug forever on the TV and therefore saving the cost of even further.

    Don't get me wrong, I still enjoy watching the odd DVD or dare I say video at home, but it's all de-tuned and I don't have to have the expensive upgrade to make my TV digital ready.

    I now enjoy spending more quality time with family and friends.

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  • dirkaardvark
    Love rating 0
    dirkaardvark said

    Tiscali may be cheap, but it seems you get what you pay for. Tiscali have by far the worst customer service I have ever encountered, so just hope nothing ever goes wrong with yours!

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  • SirRunRunRunaway
    Love rating 0
    SirRunRunRunaway said

    This article is a nice idea, but doesn't add up. Comparing like for like is important. I know as a long time Tiscali customer, free phone line rental is probably never going to happen where I live. If you're in the right area, great, but those that aren't (like me) are stuffed - you just have to pay the monthly charge plus BT line rental. I have even signed up for Tiscali's reduced line rental, but thanks to their lack of competence, it never happened. I'm quietly thankful to be honest because, on reflection, they're so difficult to get any real support from (especially when they're in the wrong) that if there was a problem with my phone line, I'd dread to think how they'd deal with it. You sign up with Tiscali because they're cheap and you hope you won't have problems. It's like buying your electricity from a bloke in a van who delivers it through a wet bit of string, but charges that much less than anyone else can. Surely people don't want the same thing from their TV service, do they?! Freeview works great if you have a decent TV aerial (and signal), which, if you don't, could set you back £150 (fitted) for a new one. Sky's offering's are great, but there's a price scaling between a home with a single TV and one with multiple TV's that want to watch different channels. If you want a no subscription setup, there's also FreeSat, and you can get a few channels in HD, but obviously you need a dish and box or spanking new TV with it integrated (the box I mean, not the dish!).

    Some lucky people might save cash by reviewing their TV viewing habits. If you're hard up for money, consider cancelling that subscription or dropping to a basic level of service. A cancelled Sky subscription should still give you all the channels available on Freeview plus more. From my experience, you can't rely on a broadband providers marketing mumbo-jumbo to give you the service and price they appear to be offering. It's a particularly unfair (un)lucky dip depending on your location. You won't get this with Sky TV reception (for example) unless you're unlucky enough to be living out of the satellite footprint (like way out in the North Sea).

    If money gets really tight, cancel your subscriptions, your TV licence, sell your TV in fact - there's nothing worth watching anyway, is there?!

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  • jimsharman
    Love rating 0
    jimsharman said

    For some people the choice will come down to Broadband. I could only get 5.5 Mbs from any provider that uses BT lines - VM will soon be offering 50Mbs and I currently get 20Mbs. I have seen my friends "Free" broadband from Sky and it is sooooo Slooooow compared to VM. So if you want decent Broadband then VM is the ONLY way to go.

    A previous post talks about the V+ box, mine does not crash on a regular basis but is slow. However, unlike the sky tv guide, VM continues to show the program you are watching whilst you view the guide.

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  • devmug
    Love rating 0
    devmug said

    I was with Tiscali/Homechoice for 3 years and eventually had to move to Virgin - the Tiscali internet and tv service grew steadily worse - requiring several set top and router reboots at least every day. I could not get any assistence from customer service and the final straw was an automatic 'upgrade' which saw me lose a lot of the standard tv channels that I'd had in my package for years. Very happy with Virgin thus far, would never recommend or return to Tiscali - they just don't give a rats.

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  • starseed777
    Love rating 0
    starseed777 said

    Dear IADJUGASHVIL
    The point is with all the other offerings you have a choice,suscribe or not, with the beeb its compulsary, in a free market where free choice could be made the revenue to the BBC would be halved at least especially when they looked in the TILL !! you would be paying more than you do now, Inam not the usual BBC basher ,I don,t like being forced to pay the fee,

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  • cv1284
    Love rating 0
    cv1284 said

    No one has mentioned the BT package, I am moving on friday and have already got BT Broadband, as, so far in my experience is the best quality BB if a little expensive, So thought I would go for the BT vision as well - you get a 10 day cooling off period so I will have a look see what I think and go from there. My parents have Sky+HD which is awsome but we dont view a lot of the channels so have gone for the Bronze with Films and Sports it also comes with 12 months of Setanta sports for free (initial £10 Charge.) Our initial plan and budget included the Full SKy+HD package so only paying £14 a month for BT we will be saving money. I would not recommend Tiscali AT all the quality of their Broadband is poor kept getting disconnected for no reason since changing to BT have had no problems.

    The only problem with the advertised packages is that its not always as it appears, Tiscali Broad band is poor, Sky you can only get the free sky Broadband if Sky have their equipment installed at your local exchange other wise you have to pay for their limited broadband connection at £17 a month Extra.

    From the comments Virgin is pretty pants and BT is expensive. I think the biggest question is what is the best value for money Quality/Quantity.

    Ideally you would like to have BT Broadband and Sky Tv Package with the Tiscalli Price tag!

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  • flamingo50
    Love rating 0
    flamingo50 said

    Without sky, we have no reception on any channel, it is a problem in our area. We don't have a choice of cable either. Since our sky box stopped working in March, we have to rely on downloads such as iplayer. Better than nothing, but we are with Tiscalli and though we are entitled to 8mb, we barely get one. I don't want the hassle of changing to another as more often than not it causes do much disruption to you internet which I need for my business.
    Only once I have needed to cal tiscalli in five years thankfully, I was not impressed with their service...

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  • Iowarth
    Love rating 0
    Iowarth said

    You say "Bundles are the way forward" although you make it quite clear that this is a personal view. Some of the comments above lead me to believe I am not the only one for whom this is completely useless. I do not have anything other than the four basic channels and we watch TV about 4 times a week. Could we be tempted to more? Most certainly yes - but NOT by paying for bundles/packs/packages invariably containing one thing we want and the rest complete rubbish! All of these providers are still sadly lacking in sufficient flexibility - and are growing rich on people paying through the nose for the handful of things they want and the mass of dross they don't. Freeview would do us - but without cable/satellite we are doomed here until the very end of the digital switch-over.

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  • pritchthestitch
    Love rating 0
    pritchthestitch said

    Ummm...Beeb bashers. We pay a licence fee for TV and radio entertainment. With Sky/Virgin and the rest you pay a subscription for how many channels...and how many are worth watching? Freeview does fine thank you. No money from me into Murdoch's pocket.

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  • UKCodeMonkey
    Love rating 4
    UKCodeMonkey said

    If you are leaning towards Sky, one of its main perks is that all customers get free Sky broadband with its TV service.

    Only if the exchange your on has been unbundled, if it's not it'll cost you £17pm

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  • simonrobins
    Love rating 0
    simonrobins said

    I agree with the comments about Virgin's customer service. I decided to move to Sky last Christmas. To start with they increased my final month's bill by 250% from £30 to £75, I then spent some time getting them to reduce it £10 at a time over the next 2 months until it finally reached £30 at which point I settled and paid over the phone. I then received a Telemessage demanding that I pay the outstanding amount with no indication of who was demanding the money but making clear that bailiffs would be sent around very soon if I didn't pay up, and a phone number that was an answering machine that couldn't take messages because it was full!!

    Never again!

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  • lettucehead
    Love rating 0
    lettucehead said

    We joined NTL (now Virgin) for phone and internet 7 years ago when BT wouldn't upgrade our phone exchange for Broadband. Had a few problems after Virgin took over (our fault - due to computer upgrade) and they were quickly sorted. Internet has only gone down once or twice in that time.

    We recently found our phone call charges were significant (£20 pm) so for less outlay (£39 pm - saving £10) went for standard broadband, free evening/weekend calls, TV (L package) and a V+ box. So far very impressed. Particularly like the BBC i-player content. The V+ box is faster for programme guides than our previous Freeview with better features.

    No complaints with Virgin - hope their employee cutbacks don't change things!

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  • Mistyduck
    Love rating 0
    Mistyduck said

    Please spare a thought for some of us who live inthe backwaters of the country. I live in one of the major towns of North Wales but, as far as I am aware, there are no cable installations within 40 miles of me. The telephone networks are old and unloved so my broadband connection only reaches 2MB despite living less than a mile from the exchange - and that's a massive improvement on the 0.5MB I used to get until I bullied BT into changing the wires to the house.
    Freeview is not available here yet. Sky is my only option for a subscription package but in my opinion it is grossly overpriced. There is little or no chance of Sky having any competition around here so the prices will stay high. Perhaps that's where the phrase "Sky high" came from?

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  • MansfieldC
    Love rating 0
    MansfieldC said

    Nobody has mentioned the on demand service from Virgin - It's great.
    Plenty of programs you can just watch at any time. No fuss.

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  • phil16v
    Love rating 0
    phil16v said

    Sky has a problem with the HD box - lip sync is badly out on HD channels. They know about the problem, but if you e-mail support about it, you hear nothing for a week, then get a message apologising for the delay, and letting you know that they can't respond to the email because they're too busy! Like most service providers these days, 'service' seems to be a forgotten, and irrelevant, art.

    If you think that's bad, try Tiscali. I've been stuck at 576kb/s for the last year and a half, ever since a BT engineer changed some settings on my line card to see if it would cure the repeated disconnections I was experiencing. It didn't, but the next engineer who came along diagnosed some faulty equipment in the exchange, and the fault went away. Tiscali keep telling me that they have asked BT to sort out the problem, but it never happens, and they can't do anything more. As I'm not a BT broadband customer, BT won't talk to me about it, and Ofcom was born toothless and still hasn't started teething. Seems the only fix would be to move house.

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  • winxpert
    Love rating 0
    winxpert said

    Joined Telewest in 2006, upgraded last year to the TV Drive (later to become V+), had no problems at all with them, Virgin have only ever messed up with the ebilling by failing to send the notification email. Upgraded to the XL broadband package last year with the M phone & TV package. On the anniversary of the account I phoned Virgin and requested a cancellation so that I could go to Sky; instantly put on hold for a few moments and the person I spoke to came back with a bill reduction, the whole package @ £40 pm.
    Virgin offer a loyalty bonus/discount of around £20 pm.
    With my savings I got Sky installed upstairs and am in the process of using dish to add 2 further satellite receivers in the kids' bedrooms (using a £10 splitter and 2 freesat boxes @ £40 each, both from Maplin, along with some cable & F plugs) thus saving a further £20 pm subscription to Sky multiroom and the cost of the 2 Sky boxes.
    All in all the savings outweigh the outlay, broadband is £37pm, so the V+ box, phone & TV package only cost £3pm.
    Very satisfied with my V+ and 20Mb broadband.
    Incidentally, B & Q do a £40 freesat system that includes the dish for those that want a diy system and save even more on subscriptions.

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  • ss770640
    Love rating 1
    ss770640 said

    sky are fantastic! i have had sky for 2 years + broadband & HD quality box. only gripes are the occassional indian call centre and long hold times on the phone. apart from that no problem! since when did sky remove sky one from its service? i think the author means virgin removed sky from its service?!?!?!?

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  • starseed777
    Love rating 0
    starseed777 said

    HEY PRITCHTHESTICH
    the licence fee goes to the BBC /100% its called a licence to make it more palatable, but it aint,its a charge, If you want to pay fine, some of us do not, and if you look at the very generous pensions these characters get when they leave its a disgrace, They should commercialise it on the free market then we would have a democracy, its obvious you know little about the finances of the BBC or you are benefiting from it. either way you are wrong

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  • bigdogfan
    Love rating 0
    bigdogfan said

    We were paying for our phone and broadband to BT last year. We had a separate Sky+ Box. Seeing our monthly costs go up and up we decided to go for a bundle with Sky - Sky Talk. The changeover to Sky Broadband was a bit of a nightmare but eventually we got it sorted ( the kind of nightmare which would make you think twice before undertaking it again!!). We also have our old Sky box installed in the bedroom at £5 a month. All in all for us we have saved getting on for £300 a year. The Sky+ Box goes wrong every now and again and we have to go through the Sky Technical Help Line (which always seems to be busy) but it's always sorted out. As far as I can see all these providers have their problems - the constantly changing and improving technology in itself is part of the problem Are we satisfied - yes - about 90%. The last time the box had a hiccup we sorted it out and ended up with a further £12 a month shaved off the monthly price - something to do with a loyalty deal as we've been with them so long. I'm not complaining.

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  • newsboy01
    Love rating 0
    newsboy01 said

    As a Freesat user, I am trying to get Sky HD by only paying the £10 per month, without the other Sky channels. It means buying a Sky HD box at the full price from a dealer, or second-hand and then getting a card. But from where? Sky do not advertise this option, but say it is available. Sports and Movies would not be included, without buying the mixes. Anyone done this?

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  • MrPound
    Love rating 11
    MrPound said

    BEEB Bashers - Whilst kind of agree with you about being forced to pay for the licence, the value of rmoney you get with the BBC is immeasurable compared to the other providers. Not only do you get the best programmes presented in the best way possible, you also get the free radio (which can be listened to in your car not like just digital) plus innovations such as the iplayer. The TV channels are decidedly different to each other depending on their audience and this is the same for radio. They commission and produce new cutting edge documentaries, drama and comedy. They give free music festivals and concerts throughout the year (unlike the V-festival which is commercial and very expensive) and the BBC website is the best website on the planet, even including this one.
    I have a freeview box but would like some kind of + system (remember the Tivo). We already get Sky Sports News and Sky 3 as well as BBC3/4 and E4. Dave is a good channel too. I can't justify paying £30+ for cack that you get on Sky / Virgin. My parents have Sky+HD with all the Sports and I laugh when I see all the rubbish that they pay for. I would like to watch SOME of the football but could easily get footie overload. At the end of the day if I had to pay for only one provider, I could easily live with the BBC only!

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  • breechers
    Love rating 0
    breechers said

    I pay £57 per month for the full Sky package including HD (don't use sky broadband as Talktalk provide it free with their telephone offering). I have to say that the sky box with its features is absolutely fantastic. And as for HD - once you have watched a film or sport in it everything else seems so dated. Sky seem to be transmitting more & more programs every month in HD.

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  • killickbecki
    Love rating 0
    killickbecki said

    We are with BT and the article above doesn't do it justice. The package that i'm on is the TV on demand. Unlike other "on demand" services from Sky and others we can watch the programs whenever we want at a click of a button (not just for the next 7 days). The expiry date of the program is clear and usually atleast 6 months in the future.
    Our jobs means that we are rarely in the house at the same time every week and so can't watch TV series conventially. The Vison box records programs as standard (not having to pay extra for a Sky + box) and the series link works a treat.

    No contest in my book.

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  • chris280
    Love rating 0
    chris280 said

    You Sad, Sad people, why do you all follow like lambs to slaughter?

    Do you not realise that if you stood firm and did not pay Sky, Virgin and all the other rubbish services, the content would become available on the likes of freesat. It would also mean the obscene fees paid to our pathetic sportsman would stop and we will see a return to proper sportsmanship and pride to put on the shirts of clubs and country.

    Get a life, don't pay, get out and actually take part in sport and get fit.

    And if you want to discover the world get off the sofa and do it for real, it's much more fun.

    It is time that we the people forced a change and we can do it so easily but for the lambs.

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  • GANDERUK
    Love rating 0
    GANDERUK said

    I had until very recently been with NTL/Virgin for the past five years . no real complaints ,customer service in the NTLs days varied from bad to absolutely shocking but on the rare occasion I have had to call them since VM took over I have noticed a n improvement. However I was becoming more aware that £40 a month for a 20mb broadband service was a little on the steep side. I decided in the end (with a little trepidation) to switch to Sky..I have to say I am delighted the whole installation process went without a hitch . A £30 installation fee got me the dish ,sky + box (had to take a premium TV package to get it free) 16mb broadband (of which I am getting download speeds close on 14mb VMs 20MB was around 10mb). The monthly fee is £38 . I have not had to deal with Skys customer service yet so I cannot comment on that but all other aspects have been excellent

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  • northnorfolk
    Love rating 0
    northnorfolk said

    Here in North Norfolk:

    no channel five
    no freeview
    0.5mb broadband
    no free broadband from either TalkTalk or Sky

    Had to get sky (on basic package)years ago in order to watch channel 5 and to change to freesat means buying a new box. New HD box comes out anytime soon but no doubt will cost £200+. I personally would rather pay the tv license and no further fees!

    Life just seems to be a giant consumer rip off these days.

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  • Pip0375
    Love rating 0
    Pip0375 said

    There are also packages such as Tiscali TV that are very competitive... Basically you get your living room TV through the Internet. You can get all the sky channels such as sky sports/movies etc, the bonus is your line rental & broadband are included in the price.

    Very cheap basic package for £19.99 per month (first three months- about £22 after) including your line rental and broadband!

    If doing a report like this the whole market should be covered - any one know of any others?

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  • Eureka08
    Love rating 0
    Eureka08 said

    I thought Blueyonder which became Virgin was the best Broadband package for speeds etc. And I much prefered the TV package as well.

    Had to move out of a cable area into a BT area so SKY is my provider now.

    I was totally miffed as I had bought a Sky HD package to go with my new TV ( great ) but then someone told me about a Cashback ( ei42.com/almabell ) site that paid £38 back for the same package. DOH !

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  • bouncingbanker
    Love rating 0
    bouncingbanker said

    A couple of comments.

    1. Tiscali

    I was with Pipex for umpteen years with no problems at all until they were taken over by Tiscali. One attempted upgrade in July this year failed miserably (they said it would be seamless) and left my business without braodband connectivity for weeks. I am still trying to get back the subscriptions they drew from my credit card continuous direct debit (don't even get me started in that scheme), having spent hours on their premium charge support line to no avail. They never return calls when promised, they cannot process anything within a 31 day account cycle, they cannot confirm their actions (apparently they are not allowed to write emails or letters). To the point of having to go to the small claims court in order to get my money back (again, they are unable to provide a refund immediately in order to avoid the court and admin fees of £100 - go figure).

    The root cause of the disconnection was due to the accounts department (!!) pulling the plug on the new service because I was not entitled to it, however this was never communicated to their technical staff or customer support team. In fact the only people who knew what the problem was was ironically their cancellations department.

    Suffice to say, if Tiscali were the last ISP standing, I would rather go to the closest internet cafe 56 miles from home. Thankfully, PlusNET have been absolutely brilliant, both in terms of access speed (the same as BT at 8.1Mbps) and support.

    2. Bundles

    As others have already mentioned, the bundles are not available in all areas. Plus the broadband speed offered and download restrictions within each bundle should be included so that you can compare like with like.

    3. Sky

    Yes, they can be expensive especially if like me you do not or can not connect your digibox to your telephone landline. I know why they don't like that (because people pay a UK subscription and install their digibox in their villa in Marbella) so I put up with the extra cost.

    And yes, their offshore support call center is sometimes impposible to deal with, they rarely understand the requests made, (not always of a technical nature) and have a habit of screwing up requests (I am still trying to recover from their latest, I don't want to lose my saved recordings on Sky+).

    BUT... Sky+/HD is superb and a satelite dish is absolutely necessary in an area of poor reception. Plus you can watch any Sky channel via the internet when you are away from home (great for my kids whilst they are at uni). Yes, you can hook up to Freesat for a decent signal but that doesn't get you the films or sports. And as I watch a lot of sport and films, I couldn't do without Sky. You get what you pay for and for me, when the monthly subscription is less than the cost of one visit per month to watch my team play live, Sky does the trick.

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  • roscho
    Love rating 0
    roscho said

    Totally agree with MrPound. We have freeview box, but even with many of the available channels we end up watching BBC channels. We refuse to pay the amounts required monthly - well said Chris280. If you stop watching you have so much extra time in your life for more important things. Try spending quality time with your children - they need it these days, or reading or other hobbies.

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  • Hitman101
    Love rating 1
    Hitman101 said

    I chose Cable over Satellite because in spite of improvements with digital technology, Satellite Transmissions can still be disrupted by weather, and there is no way to discretely install a dish, for example in a loft so it is not an eye sore.

    My gripe with all providers is that they lack the imagination to provide decent value packages. Sky is starting to improve.

    Firstly I believe that it is inappropriate for ADSL users to be compelled to have a phone for the privilidge of using ADSL. This is just another example of the BT monopoly throwing it's weight around. The cable carrying phone and ADSL does not have to carry both services it can quite happily carry just ADSL. So there is no value or justification for having to pay BT's line rental or an uplift in an ADSL to cover this cost.

    Similarly I believe that there is no justification for Virgin to compel all users to take a phone line as part of most packages, particularly any package which trys to compete with other companies.

    Current Standard phone technology has not changed much for decades and the cost of such technology should be negligable not to mention the call charges.

    I think it is high time that these phone systems should be replaced with a Voip style service which can be carried as Data over the ADSL or Cable rather than as a standard analogue service.

    ADSL would certainly improve because of not having to compete/share a line with an Analogue signal, and there would be no reason to pay two separate and significant charges for physical phone line with ADSL services and to have a separate analogue phone live for cable.

    Additionally I find it offensive that Virgin advertises to having Fibre To The Home in a vain effort to snatch customers away from BT, when the majority of existing and new subscribers are actually only getting Coaxial (Arial) Type Cable albeit of a higher quality from the Cabinet and that there is no apparent effort to upgrade these connections - at least not for those customers on basic or midrange packages. I think Virgin should under advertising rules be forced to justify the ads by providing actual figures and a more accurate statement or withdraw the advert and compensate all their customers old and new.

    Now I spoke of having a lack of imagination, by this I mean the inability of Virgin in particular to provide customers with the means to choose the channels that they want.

    As other have said, most people are not interested in 90% of the channels provided and Virgin should take the initiative to revise it's system along the lines that Sky has but perhaps both still need to refine these services a bit.

    Firstly I would suggest a rental charge for the box - say £2 Basic or £4 Advanced or inclusive in a bundle of other services, which would include all freeview and freesat channels. I would then divvy up the remaining channels except for some premium channels into themed addon packages. You can also split the addon packages into tiers to include basic channels and optional new HiDef channels so you might pay £2 per basic addon package and another £1 for HiDef channels

    Such themes might include sport, news, young children, older children, movies, science fiction, fantasy, horror, General Entertainment, Radio.

    Since people can choose what they want Virgin may find that many customers may make choices which earn them significantly more money.

    Furthur both Sky and Virgin can analyse both subsriber/package levels and viewing patterns to determine what channels customers are not particular interested in and perhaps remove those channels which are not being used and invest in more popular channels.

    I think that it is also time that Internet Service Providers should be a bit more creative also. Most customers have to deal with ADSL performance due to distance from the exchange, all customers have to deal with Contention Ratios where your 2/4/8/12/20/50MB "theoretical" connection is actually the maximum speed you may get after technical "distance" issues, if none of the 20-50 other customers use their connections, Bandwidth Throttling so if you use Volume services like downloading large files via FTP or viewing AV Streaming broadcasts and finally Volume Caps, particularly over Mobile and ADSL networks

    Firstly I think that customers should be offered the option to pay for actual speed rather than theoretical speed. Also Speeds should be tiered so you can pay charges for a basic speed and have the option of periodically or permanently increasing speed, So you might start with a 2MB/s connection then opt to upgrade to 4, then 6 then 8 or similar. Service Providers should not have the right to block any services (unless that service breaches law) but may throttle certain services if and only if the average period usage exceeds a certain level, say for example 75% of monthly Volume limit. Service Providers should also provide options to increase available Volumes or temporarily lift caps.

    As for bundling (phone, TV, Internet, mobile, etc) I think that instead of compelling users to take specific services e.g. phone or else, they should just provide a list of charges for services and then offer a discount for taking a bundle with 2 or more services for example charges might include an equipment rental charge and a service related charge, and perhaps you might get for example 20% of for a 2nd, 40% of for 2nd and 3rd or 60% off for 2nd+3rd+4th.
    e.g. I would opt for TV+Internet+Mobile - not standard phone.

    Whatever charges are made for equipment, services including Internet Access, Mobile Phone, Standard Phone, TV entertainment, if Virgin and Sky can come up with more customer friendly options and rates, they would find that many existing customers would potentially spend more perhaps a little less on TV but may subscribe to other services in compensation and there would actually be a little more competition for new subscribers.

    I don't really care for any other service providers including BT - for example BT's TV services including ADSL and TV, I am sure the TV service eats into the Bandwidth of the ADSL connection, and since ADSL bandwidth is poor for most people, often much less than 50% of the advertised speed, to get TV services, the ADSL speed must suffer terribly! Other than the new Fibre offering which we may all eventually see in about 5-10 years time which will be extremely expensive which will improve the service there is little BT can offer

    I agree that Ofcom is worse than useless. I think that all services and product must be approved by an effective third party before they can be made available, and Ofcom needs to be agressive to increase competition, particularly between mobile providers.

    I think Mobile providers should be compelled to offer a non-subsidised service to subscribers, where the phone is not subsidised by "line" Rental or by call charges. I'd rather pay £200 for a good phone, and £5 line rental rather than £25 (£300) for an inclusive phone. I'd also rather pay for a basic line rental that does not include free minutes, then optionally upgrade to add in free minutes or texts for example £2 for 50 inclusive minutes, £1 for 100 inclusive texts, and that such inclusive usage must not expire ever until it is used.

    Any provider that says such features are not possible are lying - their billing systems can be reconfigured to provide almost any imaginable features the service provider cares to imagine - I know I have worked with Billing Systems

    Above all else All providers must provide Fair Charges and Real Value for Money for all services whether these are standalone or as part of a Bundle and should not Coerce or Compel a customer to take a service they do not want or need to get other services or pay through the nose for something that is not worth the money charged, and a service paid for must not expire,

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  • Browndipper
    Love rating 0
    Browndipper said

    Cheapest of all, don't pay any fees - even the BBC license fee - and watch programmes on BBC iPlayer (and the equivalents from sky, C4 and ITV). Doing this has made my life much better because I'm not limited to what's 'on'. I now don't end up watching crap half the time. Also save a bundle of cash.

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  • CattanoogaCat
    Love rating 0
    CattanoogaCat said

    I live in the Cambridge area and was with Virgin (TV/phone/broadband) for just over 4 years. I live in a flat so couldn't get Sky and never bothered to check if we had the correct aerial for Freeview, stupid me.
    It's been 4 years of MISERY with Virgin, the broadband didn't work at all for at least 3 days a week and the TV service was disgusting, channels freezing up and disappearing, engineers called on a quarterly basis, very very annoying.
    I'm very happy now with Freeview, hardly miss any channels I had before - if there's nothing to watch I play a game, watch a DVD, do housework, play with the pets, go out, sleep!
    I've also switched the phone to BT and broadband to Tiscali for a year now and haven't had a single problem so far (when I didn't receive the wireless router I called them and it was sorted in 24 hours)! So I suppose it really depends on where you live...
    Bundles might be cheaper but if something goes wrong you're stuck!

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  • nonstarter
    Love rating 0
    nonstarter said

    Like a lot of other people who live in rural areas, up to 8MB is of no use. We are fortunate to get 2MB. No company is interested in supplying a service that will not be financially viable to them (we will never get mains gas despite living only 2miles from a main "A" road).
    I stopped subscribing to Sky a couple of years ago when the packages went up and the programmes I wanted (not sport)were put into the most expensive subscriptions. I still have access to 100's of free channels on Sky without paying any subscription.The Sky card I already had allows free sat stations on tp og the free viewe stations (all tyhe BBC channels are free views due to liscence fees, ITV is free sat. Like someone else mentioned ealier, I have two TVs connected toSky box with aeriel cable, one is a vey old square TV, pre scart sockets but brillent sound, and is linked with a majic eye (cost under £10), the other a wide screen. The settings allows you to set the TV ratios for each aeriel. I have a 3rd new TV, flat screen with built in freeview card. I use this a a portable TV as I discovered I could pick up all the TV channel groups with a £10 Telecam portable aeriel from Argos. Iplayer and free internet TV portals allows access to 100's of other channels (including new films not yet on sky). Just cnnect a laptop to a TV for big picture. That's the TV package sorted out at no monthly cost.
    I do use Tiscali for broadband and line rental, the basic (cheaper than paying BT £11) but get a good bundle of call minutes from my mobile provider for £6 a month including texts so I use the mobile for phone calls. (have not gone down the skype route yet. I also use an on line free text service, easier than using a mobile phone keypad.
    Si It can still be cheaper to make up your own package.

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  • akfwillow
    Love rating 0
    akfwillow said

    Get FREESAT
    What's wrong with you all? Unless you are frantic to get sports channels, convert your Sky dish or get a new dish tuned to Freesat (launched by BBC and ITV last May). You also need a box for each set. After that there is nothing to pay. All my sets are old but I get excellent SD pictures abd a big choice of channels. More are being added all the time. Like an earlier contributor, I like information not sport and would very much like the History and Discovery channesl - but I cannot afford and will not pay a penny to any service run by Rupert Murdoch. Many of these programmes turn up om BBC later anyway.

    I live in the country so there is no cable option. Now I am ready for the switchover and later, if I can afford it and prices come down, I can get an HD ready set for my main one and receive all HD programmes as they are introduced - though I am perfectly satisfied with SD reception.
    As far as I can make out, I am the only user of FREESAT in the village. Look it all up on a site called Your Free UK TV

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  • zootho
    Love rating 0
    zootho said

    The problem with all of them is customer service. Sky's relies downfall is that it relies on BT, which is one of the most disorganised companies on the planet.

    Virgin is just generally sloppy, and has a habit of withdrawing channels in a bid to get you to upgrade.

    Sky is sales-obsessed, and uses customer service as a sales opportunity. And you can't see or even hear the programme you're watching when checking the listings.

    Virgin used to let you tuck the useless channels (e.g. Gems) or unsubscribed channels out of the way. No longer. Like Sky, they want to keep you aware of what you're not getting, however often you have said you don't want it.

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  • TooFool4School
    Love rating 0
    TooFool4School said

    Mr Pound.

    I couldn't have put it better myself (and I've tried on a number of occasions!)

    Not so eloquent an argument have I ever heard for the BBC, what do we pay for TV license, about £100 a year. When compared to the money I spend on Virgin every month, there's no contest when it comes to value for money.

    I do still think Jonathon Ross being paid £6M per year is an absolute outrage, and I'm sure there are many Fat Cats a the Beeb make equally riduculous sums.

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  • TooFool4School
    Love rating 0
    TooFool4School said

    Cont...

    On the V vs Sky argument, I don't think there's a lot to choose between them, I'm with Virgin and rate the V+ service quite highly. I looked at my options before joining V 2 years ago, and I think V is definatelyt better value.

    However the one thing this article highlights is how (deliberately) complicated the pricing structures are, making it almost impossible to make useful comparisons.

    Get OFFCOM involved to force these companies to simplify their prices I say!

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  • justb
    Love rating 0
    justb said

    I have Sky downstairs for the sport and Virgin upstairs, they gave me a box for £1 a month for 12 months cos I have their broadband and phone line. I will probably not keep it after the 12 months is up as we dont use it as much as we expected to, so we will stick with freeview upstairs.
    I have had various combinations in the past and this suits me best. I think we can all run around chasing the cheapest deal and not getting actually what we want from the TV etc.

    As far as the BBC is concerned since it is one of the channels I watch most frequently and the programmes are well done even if a little similar, I dont have a problem in paying the licence fee (we get the radio too). God forbid we should end up with only the kind of rubbish they get in America.

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  • Ianaries100
    Love rating 0
    Ianaries100 said

    I use Freeview with the Top Up TV option at £9 p/m. You get to choose the channels you like and then they, that is the Top Up TV people, download TV content to a DTR (Digital Tv Recorder in Top Up speak) from those channels and it saved for a week.In other words, they pick the content for you based on some sort of criteria. I also have about 34 hours of personal space to record anything I like from the regular Freeview channels. Is this the best option, no not really but I do have much more TV available to me than I can watch, some of the downloaded stuff is good, some is bad and occasionally there is a gem of a find. I have had a problem with the DTR and the people at Freeveiw were great.

    I also have the Talk Talk phone/broadband service and again it is not the cheapest option but I do get free calls all day every day up to 69 minutes in the UK and also outside the UK, including mobile in the USA and Canada, handy if you have friends overseas. In other words I get free calls (OK up to 69 minutes per call) and 8Mb (Hmm) BB plus TV for £30 p/m.

    I have read all the bumph from Virgin and SKY and it appears that I have to take a whole lot of channels I have no interest in to get the few I am interested in. Also even though I do not have an account with Virgin I have had issues with them. I get mail sent to my address for one of their customers. He has never lived at this address and there is no Virgin equipment installed here and yet the insist on sending me all kinds of stuff and when I call them to ask them to stop they start of by insisting that the gentleman in question does indeed live here and then they tell me that I cannot change the address as it is not my account. I explain that I don't want to change the address I want mine removed.........never mind, needless to say their customer service department is absolutely dreadful!

    Enough whingeing, sorry, thanks!

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  • Soop2
    Love rating 0
    Soop2 said

    "In addition, one of the most important things to remember is that in order to take advantage of Virgin’s deals, you need to take out a Virgin phone line, which costs £11 a month (although you can keep your existing phone number)."

    No you don't. I have TV and Internet without that.

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  • Ianaries100
    Love rating 0
    Ianaries100 said

    Oh by the way, I did not want to start a whole rant about the BBC and the license fee, however I will say that I think it is quite fair for what we get, 4 TV channels 7 national radio channels (if you have digital equipment) a rather comprehensive Web site with the iPlayer. There is a lot of TV content that could not be made without the kind of funding the Beeb has, just think about the quality of David Attenborough's documentaries or indeed the fact the BBC HD is out there already. If you really want to get a good perspective on this discussion then the best person to listen to is Stephen Fry. If I may be so bold to point those of you who are intersted in the right direction:

    http://www.stephenfry.com/media/audio/4/episode-4--broadcasting/
    This will poin t in the right direction for the MP3 and m4A files.

    Or you can read it here:
    http://www.stephenfry.com/blog/?m=200806#more-44

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  • ridiculous6115
    Love rating 0
    ridiculous6115 said

    re Beeb bashers: you DON'T pay the licence fee to receive the BBC. You pay a licence fee to have receiving equipment in your house. Even if you could prove that it is impossible for you to receive the BBC tv channels you still have to have a licence. It just happens that when tv started the BBC was there and the licence fee was given to them. The commercial tv came along and they were allowed have ads from which they get their financing. Then Sky etc to which you pay a subscription if you want it. I prefer to think that my license fee goes towards making those fantastic BBC programmes - documentaries, natural history, costume drama etc.

    As for Sky v Virgin - did you ever try to change?
    HELL! Bit like trying to change your broadband provider. DON'T TRY IT.

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  • SaidRich
    Love rating 0
    SaidRich said

    As I have to keep my responses Polite etc., I feel somewhat limited. My thoughts are that it is High Time the Beeb fee was done away with and that org' made to support itself- with the possible exception of the News and Weather braodcasts. There is an adequate choice of alternatives these days - so why should we all be forced to support the choices of those able to dictate that BBC output includes such claptrap as the talk /chat shows endless quiz programmes and 'so-tired' soaps EE, for one. I am not interested in the "sport" events, which certainly are nothing to do with real sport, merely another basis for highly commercial interests, and of course rip-off's.
    As for the other main liners sky- I dont want anything to do with Them, and Virgin whom I do use - supply me with the basic channels via cable which is ok, but of course limited. I have noted that advanced programme notification has recently been 'confused ' or non-existent, however, possibly due to the linitation of our payments?
    I have todate been quite satisfied with virgin service which is far better than twas from NTL,
    Broadband at our lowly level is also fine, although I am looking towards extending to incorporate extra PC's/laptop (Secure) wireless in the near future and wonder if this will mess things up at all? I hope not, and expect not.
    I have frequently looked at and pondered the Freeview options, but think a new arial system may be required, so tis a little off-putting.
    Anyone who wants to pay for the expensive larger packages of course is entitled to do so but should not be subject to rip-off's and buggeration!

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  • pitchpolepete
    Love rating 0
    pitchpolepete said

    Re Pipex/Tiscali's phone+broadband, I can confirm BouncingBaker's experiences. I had 4 months of extreme broadband connection problems (up to 48hrs+ just to connect!), and Pipex effectively refused to involve BT to fix the line. This was followed by 2 months down to ~2 hours per week connection (yes, 2 hours per week). Naturally, all the calls to the Pipex "Helpline" are really prolonged & charged for (up to 89p!!), nice one!

    Pipex eventually told me they could no longer supply the service & to find another supplier (!) which of course I did. With the new provider, BT were out the first available working day to fix the line....

    Thankfully I cancelled the Direct Debit arrangement at the changeover : thankfully, because Pipex next made out that I had changed my mind & that I wanted to retain their phone service (apparently this sort of thing is do-able in a 10-day window under Ofcom rules - see http://www.ofcom.org.uk/complain/landline/slamming/ ). They even managed to disable outgoing calls for over a month while this was sorted. I have made a formal complaint to Ofcom re their actions. Ofcom also advised that I had to get the new supplier to make a formal complaint (I doubt whether they did though...).

    Well, 3 months on Pipex are still sending me ever-escalating bills & are now threatening to cut my line off, this in some very patronising & cheeky correspondence. AVOID these people at all costs, & that's Ofcom's opinion as well as mine!

    On a different subject, here is a little tip if you are looking to rent a line (only) from BT. You will be asked 'do you want free evening & week-end calls?' along with your line. If you say YES, you have committed to 12 months phone contract because the evening calls are NOT part of the line rental contract (the week-end calls ARE).
    You need to say NO you just want the line bundle.

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  • Nosht
    Love rating 0
    Nosht said

    Well said chris280.
    The length of this discussion just shows how pathetic some people are to complain here about their services & DO nothing about them.
    Consumers have the power, USE IT.

    Regards,

    N.

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  • pingap
    Love rating 0
    pingap said

    During a house move last year I wanted to combine my Broadband/ISP with my sky package (having got all the equipment)but Sky broadband was not available at the exchange. I looked into V+ and found it was available for far less (including not having to pay a BT line rental).

    I found the move was smooth, Virgin customer service was very good indeed (even to the point where they insisted calling me back immediately as I was incurring costs on my mobile to them!). My previous encounters with Sky over a number of years did not compare favourably at all.

    My V+ box is great, with loads more options than Sky+, one of these not mentioned being able to watch/record on x3 channels at the same time, Sky only lets you do x2, and yes that has been a benefit several times as I'm out a lot and rarely watch live transmissions. You also get far more storage capacity with actual hours remaining indicated rather than a percentage.

    The broadband is far quicker and robust than my old ISP too.

    Virgin suits my preferences far better in summary.

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  • hungary
    Love rating 0
    hungary said

    I have tiscali broadband and free phonecalls to landlines and 10 international countries anytime. However the speed of broad band is excruciatingly slow! And tiscali screens have a nasty habit of jumping whilst you are typing, as well as having a layout not quite compatible with an IMac.
    Can someone please enlighten me: We do not currently have a television, but am considering one. So what I am supposed to opt for? I am not that interested in sports. Is there a package where you can choose your channels? Friend shave Sky with hunderds of channels, most of which seem utter rubbish. Any suggestions?

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  • franc0phile
    Love rating 0
    franc0phile said

    I find that the most cost-effective way was to buy a secondhand sky dish and digibox from the smallads and install it myself (not rocket science), and buy a freeview box (to maximise the number of channels available). This set-up gives me all the good channels (bar Discovery & UKTVetc).
    Regarding the licence fee, you only have to compare the (mostly) reality rubbish on ITV/C4/C5 to the quality programming on BBCetc, to see where the money is being spent; Still, I suppose they have to pander to the LCDs in order to sell the advertising space.

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  • TVwally
    Love rating 1
    TVwally said

    I live in an area where Satellite dishes are not permitted, so I am stuck with Cable (esp as ,even with a signal booster , reception via aerial is v poor). Do I have any alternative to Virgin? I have phone, broadband and VIP package TV with 2 STBs and pay about £100 a month for this!

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  • TMFSUZY
    Love rating 0
    TMFSUZY said

    Hi guys,

    Thanks for all your great comments, tips, hints, experiences and general wealth of knowledge.

    I did try to cover all the services available, including HD and Freesat, but the article was beginning to get extremely long, and Ed would have burst a vein in his head if I'd tried to squeeze any more words into the article!

    Please, keep more of your experiences coming, this is what The Fool is about after all... :-)

    Szu

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  • atseyes
    Love rating 0
    atseyes said

    Another note or two to all the licence-fee bashers out there.
    Firstly, you do not get the commercial channels free, you pay for them when you buy branded products, because part of the price of each item pays for advertising.
    Secondly, the licence fee keeps the BBC relatively free of political bias. The only alternatives would be for the Beeb to take advertising, which is a highly competitive market anyway, or funding from general taxation, which would make it little more than a government mouthpiece.
    Personally, I think that the licence fee is well worth the money.

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  • ElectricMonk
    Love rating 1
    ElectricMonk said

    I've been with Virgin for 6 years and will never look back. I understand some ex-Telewest customers have lots of problems and the very few times I've had to call the helpdesk (when it was NTL), I had to wait quite a long time, but for the quality of service I can't complain. I can't remember the last time I had a problem with broadband and with 10Mbit download you'd have to pry it from my cold dead hands before I'd switch to any other provider.

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  • smithcvs
    Love rating 0
    smithcvs said

    I have been with Tiscali for some time now. I recently went wireless and had the TV package mentioned. I must admit that all has been well. However, looking at my card statement today, I have been charged twice for October. Waiting reply to my email from Tiscali regarding this.

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  • bigdogfan
    Love rating 0
    bigdogfan said

    I have to respond in defence of the Beeb. We watch more of their programmes than any other channel. Their drama series - particularly costume - are superb and I know are sold all over the world - earning valuable revenue. Documentaries and sports are equally great.I agree that some people in the media are paid obscene amounts of money but that is another argument and doesnt detract from the fact that the Beeb is worth every penny of the licence fee!! In this house we never watch commercial channels "live". We record our favourite progs on our Sky+ box and then play back fast forwarding through all the dreadful advertisements. The X Factor is a case in point. I love it and the other half hates it but by eliminating all the adverts we both can cope with a much shorter programme. We do the same with film on ITV etc.

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  • Ianaries100
    Love rating 0
    Ianaries100 said

    Hungary,
    If you have no TV I would go for Freesat or Freeview, this will obviously give you more channels than you have at the moment. You can get LCD TVs nowadays with Freeview built in and should be HD ready. Thi8s option means that as you have to buy a TV anyway you get all the set up you need in one go and end up with Free TV. Of course you will have to get a digital aerial and a TV license. The following websites will tell you what you need to get the two options.
    http://www.freeview.co.uk/
    http://www.freesat.co.uk/

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  • pastsellby
    Love rating 6
    pastsellby said

    Just a note for northnorfolk (10:23am)
    Had to get sky (on basic package)years ago in order to watch channel 5 and to change to freesat means buying a new box
    You've virtually got Freesat, just cancel your Sky subscription (in line with their t & c's of course). You get to keep your card in the Sky box, and still receive all the freesat channels.
    You don't get the same channel guide as available in the new Freesat boxes, but you can use Sky's own Favourite function, set your favourite channels and then use the Blue button under Channel Guide to bring up the guide for just your channels.
    Like Francophile (1:41pm), I set up my own secondhand Sky dish and box years ago, got a card from Sky for a one off payment of I think about £20 and have been receiving freesat from Sky ever since.
    I believe there must be thousands of people out there who don't realise that a subscription to Sky is NOT necessary to watch via a Sky box.
    It can be done as I've done, or as described above, or by buying the Pay Once, Watch Forever service, which gives you installation of brand new equipment! ( and which many people I've spoken to simply can't believe is true! but it is!)
    Unless your a tv sports fanatic, you can get plenty of channels without any subscription.

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  • Zweiblumen
    Love rating 0
    Zweiblumen said

    I think you meant, "If you are leaning towards Sky, one of its main perks is that all customers with a BT landline get free Sky broadband with its TV service."

    Not everyone does, as 250,000-odd people in East Yorkshire will tell you.

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  • fenemore
    Love rating 205
    fenemore said

    I have Sky Digital and an HD tv. I want to upgrade to Sky+ but having successfully avoided EVER to having my phone line connected to the Sky box (the way I did this was to NOT use SKY for the free box, OR allow them to install it). So having paid for everything myself, Sky could not force me to connect the phone line.

    But with Sky+ - it seems that even if you acquire the box through other means, you cannot sign up for the HD service without agreeing to the box being connected to the phone line? It may be their terms & conditions, but I do not see the need as long as I pay my subs. I have no intention of using any additional services - and I object to Sky collecting information on my viewing habits.

    I would be interested to know if anyone else out there has managed this!

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  • sugs04
    Love rating 0
    sugs04 said

    I have Virgin Media Cable and always had good service - hardly ever had to call them in 6 years and when I have, they have been very good.
    Recently I wanted to improve my bundle as I was out of contract and they give me XL TV, M BB and L Phone for £33 per month and no BT line rental! I also have the V+ box and love it - it gives a great picture for upscaled SD content. Some HD is available in VOD and there are whispers of more linear channels on the way ( This has been heard before though.....)

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  • HarryFarnsbarns
    Love rating 0
    HarryFarnsbarns said

    I've just found this thread and to be honest I'm staggered by the number of comments in one day! Clearly most of you people would die without television (and broadband for that matter)!

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  • essexfairy
    Love rating 0
    essexfairy said

    My advice is to avoid Tiscali! I was with them for 12 months as I was tied into a contract and the supposed Broadband I had was slow and unpredictable.

    I switched to a Sky package for only a few pounds more a month but this included the Entertainment package, Sky Talk (free evening and weekend calls) and Sky Broadband.

    Despite a few initial problems with the Broadband switch I have had no problems at all and customer servie are really helpful with any issues. You can manage your account online and upgrade at any time which I ahve recently done as my partner is working from home.

    For an all in one package I would highly recommend Sky - don't accept cheap substitutes!

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  • edb101
    Love rating 0
    edb101 said

    I used to have Tiscali for my calls and broadband and all was fine until I upgraded for them to also take control of my landline from BT. Then I was left without a working landline for 6 months and also intermittent broadband, it took over 100 emails, 15 hours of phonecalls from my mobile (use saynoto0870.co.uk to avoid paying non geographic call rates) and 2 formal letters of complaint and still they never got it working, so switched to Sky, who have been fine so far. Tiscali then continued to take money from my account, despite admitting my account was closed and I had formally cancelled my direct debit. It took another 2 months to get my money back. Their staff where pleasant enough but useless at actually getting anything done. I only ever got 1 callback, even though they promised on at least 8 occasions.


    Never again.

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  • Messyplay
    Love rating 0
    Messyplay said

    I agree with sugs04. We're with VM and when we lost the Sky channels (my kids love Simpsons and Futurame) I contacted VM to inform them that I was going over to Sky. They gave me an unbelievable offer - paying a lot less for more (ie XL TV, M broadband etc) and I also got a V+ box which is absolutely brilliant and stores 80hrs of viewing and did you know that your Sky+ Bod / dish etc after it is 1 year old if it breaks YOU the customer have to pay for the repair / relplacement. All Virgin's equipment is the property of Virgin so if it breaks or becomes faulty they simply come and give you a brand new one FOC.
    Yes the customer service is the worst possible but it's worth it for the value especially if you kick off and threaten to leave!

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  • Hitman101
    Love rating 1
    Hitman101 said

    Since there are comments concerning the TV license, I thought it appropriate to point out that since all other organisations/channels are add or sponsorship funded or subscription funded, people probably assume that the BBC is soley funded by the TV license

    Not so!!!

    Hands up ... How many people have bought a really expensive BBC Video/DVD/Audio Cassette or Magazine?

    Quite a few I would expect

    More over, how many people have phoned into shows by dialling an 08 or other special number or sent an SMS text message or MMS picture message for example to Radio Stations like Radio 1.

    Most or all of those phone calls and SMS/MMS messages are contributing to the BBC coffers, presumably so that they can scoop all those funds and give them to the overpaid management and dubious talents.

    It's not unusual for Radio 1 to receive 10, 20 even 100,000 messages a day and some of those messages may also be multipart messages contributing many £1000's to these stations each day.

    I think it is time that the BBC become self funded, they certainly rake in enough money!!!

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  • Scamspy
    Love rating 0
    Scamspy said

    On the cheap tiscali option. I have received more Nigerian scams e-mails from tiscali e-mail addresses than any other domain. I must say a lot were tiscali.it addresses and suspect that some were bounced through from elsewhere. Nonetheless I'd be wary of tiscali.

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  • patrickfarley
    Love rating 1
    patrickfarley said

    Quote from the article: 'Personally, I think bundles are the way forward -- as long as you use all the services that is.'

    Of course you never will use all the services. I had Sky+ for over 2 years. Initially £40 per month, then up to £50 per month. Even tried HD for a month, which Sky continued to charge me for another year, even after it was cancelled during the cooling off period. (They refunded after 6 phone calls + more every other month to tell them they were still charging me.)

    Finally cancelled Sky+, then a year later got BT Vision. Now I get all the benefits of recording TV, plus I can download movies anytime I want to... which turns out to be about once a month. And the box supports High Definition TVs.

    Now I do work for BT. But its still a great deal....because its not a deal. You only have to pay for what you watch.

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  • BigAndy05
    Love rating 0
    BigAndy05 said

    On a related topic - Do Not Sign up to Setanta! I completed all the details on line and waited for the signal to be sent to my satellite box but discovered that because of the positioning of my dish i cannot receive their signal.

    I contacted Setanta to explain this and they ignored my first 3 emails. i wrote to Customer Services and followed up with about 3 mored emails - I did not want to have to phone an 087 number and pay for the privledge of complaining (also if a provider can accept orders via electonic methods they should be able to accept communications too)

    Eventually Setanta said they would cancel my contract - but I must give 2 months notice. Thus I did not receive any service and they still "stole" from my credit card a connection fee and 3 months rental.

    I think everyone should be aware that Setanta are prepared to "steal" money from customers; to ignore any requests or complaints; to offer very poor customer service and expect customers to pay heavily to ring them up. Not the signs of a company that values its customers.

    At first I explained that I was going to be moving house in a couple of months and assuming that I could receive a signal at my new house would continue to subscribe from their but in the meantime could they either issue a credit note or suspend charging me when i was not getting any signal - they ignored this, obviously assuming that ripping me off for 3 months was better than having a long term customer - Great attitude!!

    Avoid them at all costs!!

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  • chris280
    Love rating 0
    chris280 said

    TMFSUZY,
    this is not what TMF is about.... I dropped by in the hope I would be proved wrong but alas not so. It is a great shame to see that this article has stirred more people to respond than the articles about the economy, etc.

    In reality this article and the majority of the comments are a total waste of time.

    I say again, consumer power can stop this consumer rip off that is continual in all walks of life. If you don't like the service stop paying and walk away, making sure you are not in breach of contract. from the sound of most of you your suppliers are themselves in breach of contract and you could probably walk away without paying a further penny.

    What really I find amazing is, I would hazzard a guess that the majority of people posting here did not give one thought to November 11th.

    SUZY if you posted an editorial here about people helping old folk (and no, I am not one of them) it is sad to say that you would not have had the same level of response.

    It is time this country dropped this consumerism got back to real family values and started to respect one another.

    It is time for a change a massive change in this country before it is too late.

    Such a shame we are driven by this instant gratification and greed so prevelant in todays society.

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  • KyzerJock
    Love rating 0
    KyzerJock said

    I think that Tiscali's customer service is without doubt the worst I have ever had the misfortune to use. I have been trying to fix a problem and over 20+ emails I have not had the same "support" person on the other end. Their server is clearly at fault in not allowing me to access my email away from home - they flatly deny it even when sent THEIR messages telling me that THEIR sever is at fault. They insist that I can't be using Outlook since EVERYONE uses Outlook Express. My broadband connection speed is half that of my next door neighbour but they will not even check it. I joined them on the promise of lower bills but my bills have gone UP because of their charging structure. To top it all they will NOT supply a MAC code to allow me to move broadband. Think long and hard before you join this crowd of sharks.

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  • chris280
    Love rating 0
    chris280 said

    In addition to my previous note..... Try this, turn off your electricity supply to your house...

    We had what I thought was to be a miss fortune of having the power cables in the street upgraded this meant on two seperate occassions we had no power for the whole day.

    Guess what it was like having my freedom back again, I couldn't use the computer, I couldn't watch Television, it was amazing I found other more satisfying things to do.

    Cancel your contracts turn off your power, think how much money and time you could save.

    There Suzy, a challenge or you and TMF look at the savings of each house installing tiles, wind turbines and ground source heat pumps to generate electricity and heating.

    Trouble is it's not "sexy" and there is effort involved and one cannot sit on the sofa and vegetate.

    oh well!

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  • foreverly
    Love rating 0
    foreverly said

    Why on Virgin am I paying £25 for the middle broadband package when you can sign up for the largest one for £20. This is excluding first six month offers?

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  • chris280
    Love rating 0
    chris280 said

    Foreverly, it's a very good question. Have you looked in the mirror yet and asked yourself the question? Or is it, you cannot understand how you were suckered?

    I rest my case for the prosecution, you all get told how good it will be and you all fall for the hype.

    To all of you, good luck and enjoy watching the spoilt rich children playing football, their having the last laugh at your expense.

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  • Accountantsmum
    Love rating 0
    Accountantsmum said

    It's clear from what Suggs and Foreverly have said, and my own experience, that what you pay for a Virgin package is simply a question of 'think of a number'. I have the same combination as Suggs: I was paying £48 a month for the 8mB broadband, phone, and basic TV, and rang to say it was very expensive compared to current offers and what would they do to keep me. I've ended up with XL TV including Setanta, 2MB broadband (in theory but frankly I've not noticed the difference, not being a mega downloader) and the L phone package. I considered moving to BT who wanted £120 or so as a fee for becoming their customer: if they want to attract people back, why isn't it them offering me the sweetener! To Chris I would say, have more faith in human nature, lots of us actually like what we get and are prepared to pay for it. Yes, we could choose otherwise but we don't. And for me, football is a great sport to watch (though I agree the players are overpaid) and watching on Setanta is far cheaper than paying some £30 a match to go to St. James' Park.
    Oh, and by the way, I was very aware of the 90th anniversary of the armistice. My Dad fought in WW2 and I'm very proud of what he did. Being a football fan doesn't make me a hooligan: I'm an opera fan as well, and the 'Carmen' last Christmas was worth the licence fee on its own.

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  • Accountantsmum
    Love rating 0
    Accountantsmum said

    PS - sorry, forgot to say that my new package is £36 a month, a bit more than Suggs but much less than I was paying before! And yes, I agree it's a rip-off that when companies lower their prices to new customers they don't do so for everyone. Come on, Ofcom; one basic rule should surely be that every customer gets charged the same for the same service.

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  • chris280
    Love rating 0
    chris280 said

    Accountantsmum,

    your argument is at least thought out. My point is that as consumers we all get ripped off on a regular basis. Not until we band together will we make a difference.
    It applies to the petrol companies as well, have you thought for one minute what could be achieved if the word was spread and on one given day it was agreed that no one (unless desperate) would use a particular companies forecourt to fill their cars? You would see that threat alone focus the fuel companies and start to reduce prices in line with the reduction of crude oil. which at the momet it isn't doing.

    What would happen if everyone in the country refused to pay their gas bills, the commercial companies would make a commercial decision and reduce the cost of Gas.

    Unfortunately it is the nature of the beast in teh UK not to complain, when we do these organisaions have created some excellent ways of delaying and putting people off.

    If you want to watch television that is fine with me, I do, however, think of the chnages we could make if we work together and force these companies to treat consumers with respect.

    Ofcom and all the other regulatory bodies would do far better if they worked to organise consumer push back on mass, they would become far more effective.

    So enjoy what you enjoy but lets support each other and win.

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  • kybosh909
    Love rating 6
    kybosh909 said

    Bundles are another sales gimmick, which you can chooose to have or not, but what about when you are given a bundle that you dont want and made to pay extra for it for the rest of your subscription even if you never use it and have never asked for it? Well thats what SKY have done.I shall digress :- i have had BB with BT for 5 years now and i will stay with them because the service has been brilliant. only once in 5 years has it ever gone wrong and a quick call to the techy's (which is included in your subscription fee) resolved it in less than an hour. also with the home hub it is even better. the techy can connect straight to your hub and investigate, firmware updates are sent to it automatically.You get free Norton on any PC, laptop you have in your house, i have 3 and Norton are charging between 40 and 50 quid a year so i save 150quid a year on that alone. you get free digital vault and free worldwide wifi.Ok its limited and you have to have the top BB package but how many ISP's have that? Now i have also been with SKY for 5 years and whilst i think they are a rip off (why should you have adverts on SKY1 when you pay a subscription for it???)it has been consistently good and suits my viewing needs better than the rest. Now this is my gripe - SKY put my subscription up by £5 per month about a year ago. in the letter they sent me advising this they told me that it was costing £5 a month more to help support the cost of the additional features and services they had introduced. Kind of like a "we are charging you 5 more but look at this great big list of extra's you get for your money" i am sure under that it should have said "yeah this should cost you 10 a month more but because we love your loyalty we will pay the other 5 - aint we nice!". expecting the list to be a couple of pages long and worth an extra fiver i read on. basically the only thing on there was that SKY BB is now free with the package, the other things were just small token things which i am sure were already in place ages ago and were on the letter just to make the list look longer. What it should have said was "We are charging you more money for something you dont really want so we can use it to pay for a poney service that we can attract new customers with and make more money" Well i dont want SKY BB, it is rubbish, i might as well go back to dial up connection - so it seems this is just a token gesture to existing and new customers to hide the fact that they want to charge me £5 a month extra.Besides that what if was tied into to my current ISP for 12 months? so its not like i just stop my current connection. BUT can i opt out and not pay the fiver? answers on a postcard please!!

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  • kybosh909
    Love rating 6
    kybosh909 said

    sorry for no paragraphs, the post editor can only fit about 10 words on it, anyone else get this?

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  • redechan
    Love rating 0
    redechan said

    Someone mentioned that since they don't live in a freeview area (like ourselves) they are stuck with Sky and a subscription. Not true! We bought our satellite receiver and dish (cost about £80) set it up and we now have about 100 channels to choose from - no subscription involved - includes all the international news channels and 5-6 film channels plus all the extra ITV's, More4, etc.

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  • Iniq
    Love rating 27
    Iniq said

    Do what I do and cut your TV bill by 100%.

    I have never owned a TV and I find it hard to believe that intelligent adults are actually gullible enough to be willing to pay good money to watch the shoddily produced, mindless drivel that I occasionally glimpse on friends' televisions.

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  • rowlystravel
    Love rating 27
    rowlystravel said

    by a dreambox, get a 80 - 90cm dish and a dish motor.

    then you can cancel sky, virgin, and even your TV license.... i think thats about the biggest saving you can make and all for less than 150 notes!!

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  • Concorde13
    Love rating 0
    Concorde13 said

    Hi, the bigest saving in life is to ditch the T.V.Licence.
    Over a life time that is a lot of money saved.
    Sorry MR Ross.

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  • RAO3ERS
    Love rating 0
    RAO3ERS said

    the only problem i have with sky talk
    is they dont give you a code to block outgoing calls
    when not at home
    daughter phones freinds mobiles.
    bill for phone charges £40 calls plus paying bt for line rental.
    virgin lets you block outgoing calls small charge.
    also sky advertises a service
    that they know 75 percent of the time they cannot provide because you are to far from telephone exchange.
    virgin is better but cant get it since i moved.

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  • mianjakesmum
    Love rating 0
    mianjakesmum said

    when we first took a bundle we were with eurobell who were eventually taken over by virgin media, i can honestly say that ive never had a problem with their customer service, theres rarely a problem with the service and if there is its never for very long. last january we were due to come out of the £30 a month deal so i called them up to ask when our contract ended as we were going to switch, they asked me why and i said that sky offered more channels for less.
    they then offered me the xl tv package, 10mb broadband and free calls all for £30 to stay, needlss to say i took them up on that.
    so before swicthing i would recommend others to call and see if they can offer you more for less :)

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  • 0DrAwkward0
    Love rating 0
    0DrAwkward0 said

    I have a 3 ofr £30 deal with Virgin. If I change From Virgin to let's say BT, I'll lose my mobile deal - £10 a month for 300 minutes & 300 texts. (More than I ever use). Same for the wife. A mobile contract with BT will cost around £30 a month (each) This extra £40 per month far outweighs any consideration of a few pounds here or there for TV. In any event a freeview box (not £20 but £14 in Asda)gives me all the channels I want (plus 80% junk). Most people only watch a very few and that includes BBC1, 2, 3, 4, Ch4, CH4+1, Ch5. Why would I care if I could get 500 shopping & 500 pop music channels, so why is Szu wittering on about the number of channels available. At the same time I could move my Broadband from Virgin and have slower download speeds - or at certain times of the day, much slower. And unlike Tiscali, when they say unlimited downloads Virgin mean just that. I've had good service from Virgin, though their predecessors, NTL were a NIGHTMARE. One last comment. You need to go live in the USA or Canada for a year or more to appreciate the joy of advert-less TV. Ask any American what they think of the BBC. For me it's well worth the licence fee. And the fee is per house - so it covers 6 TVs & a PC in our home.

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  • madf001
    Love rating 0
    madf001 said

    While I resent the tv tax people need some perspective

    BBC is forced to carry costs of digital switchover the pace of which is driven by the government

    in terms of journalism the bbc makes sure that overall standards are kept up I could imagine if no bbc we would end up with a sky/fox monopoly

    I personally would like to see more direct tax revenues invested in program making+film making to improve the quality and reduce the level of imports/raise exports and maintain a stong base for the cultural industries to also use for more commercial programming as well/

    however there is a case that of the bbc and "4" (public owned)channels possibly some of these could be scrapped
    and replaced by more specific broadcasts over the internet proms, glastonbury and on demand programming especially of repeats

    this would also allow the bbc board/burocracy to be cut back.

    Report on 18 November 2008  |  Love thisLove  0 loves
  • Derbywoman
    Love rating 0
    Derbywoman said

    Hi Folks, quickly reading through all the messages I see that there are some that have suffered as I have from Tiscali's poor service. All went well for two months and then someone pulled the plug on my Internet service. Everyone blames each other, I spent loads on their premium line trying to find out the problem until about six weeks later and still no service one of their engineers told me to go elsewhere it would be quicker. Yes, I'm with the Post Office now and they have call centres where the people actually speak and understand English!!!! So, beware of Tiscali - sound good, prices good but customer service - well there is no custmer service and no one knows what they are doing. Derbywoman

    Report on 19 November 2008  |  Love thisLove  0 loves
  • leapo
    Love rating 0
    leapo said

    I have just managed to finish my contract with Sky as I never watched the premium content and ony used the BBC and ITV. It was anbsolute nightmare trying to do this with six months of recorded letters, sureal conversations with asian call centres and an extra payment just to end the whole sorry matter after 13 years! I now have a recordable satellite box with HD using the old sky dish which I got in Germany. It is fantastic although the menu system is not quite as simple as Sky's. Sky customer service were awful whenever I had to use them. I also have a property in Portugal and everyone out there has Sky on subscription despite Sky not allowing viewing overseas. They have "special" agents who recycle cards from old UK customers which allows Sky to make it appear that they do not loose customers and also gain an estimated 1.0 million+ customers overseas. Neat eh? Oh, in case you think I make this up, I used to install satellite systems for a living. By the way, if you live in an area with a good 3g broadband link, the mobile Vodafone service is cheap, reliable and fast!

    Report on 25 November 2008  |  Love thisLove  0 loves
  • roderickhood
    Love rating 0
    roderickhood said

    Where I live I use Virgin I have now found them some what better than NTL ever was but to get the best deals I had to cancel and go go back as a new customer easy if you have your own domain.
    One thing is you get on demand when it works that is a plus as I have free view a sky dish and virgin there is alwasys somthing to watch and always a service to cancel

    Report on 25 November 2008  |  Love thisLove  0 loves
  • Adelphi1968
    Love rating 0
    Adelphi1968 said

    One thing to remember is if you have been with a company for some time (we have been with Virgin and previously Telewest for some 8 years) they are quite happy to continue overcharging you for these bundles if you do not complain. We were paying at one stage £57 per month (including all 3 services and phone calls) and I hardly use our landline phone. I had upgraded to 8mb on BB thinking it would speed up my line. After some months I came to realise that my internet speed was no better (I tested the speed using one of those internet testing services). Anyway I rang to complain to Virgin and they gave me the usual speel about the distance from the exchange may have an effect and the no. of users on line at the time I was on line could be reducing my speed. Anyway I said that I wanted my speed back down to 2mb and have actually found no difference in the speed and this has reduced the cost from £25 to £18.00. I also said I wanted my TV package reduced as I did not feel I was getting value for money. I told them I didn't want the 900 or however number of channels I was getting on my TV for channels and radio which we never use, and most channels of which we didn't watch on my XL package. They offered to reduce this and I told them the channels we mostly watched. They agreed to reduce the TV package to "L" and the price came down accordingly from £22 to £11.50 and the only channel we miss is National Geographic. I also complained that some cos. provide up to 6 international dialling calls used over the weekend for free. They agreed to let me have "Spain" for £1.50 per month extra for weekend calling as I only use this destination. She asked if I wanted fully itemised billing which costs an extra £1.00 per month (this made me laugh as they wanted me to pay to see what I am charged for calls!). Anyway I agreed to keep that as I wanted to keep track if they were overcharging me on calls.

    So now instead of paying up to £57 per month, I pay on average £38 per month, a saving of almost £20 per month for the price of a phone call.

    All of the above goes to prove that if you don't ask you don't get.

    COMPLAIN AND GET WHAT YOU WANT AT A PRICE YOU FEEL IS FAIR!

    Report on 30 November 2008  |  Love thisLove  0 loves
  • ampers
    Love rating 0
    ampers said

    Good article and even more illuminating comments.

    I would mention that the Sky Freesat one commentator mentioned is the same as the Pay once - view forever service that the journalist mentioned.

    As the BBC are so evidently neutral I ignore the bashers AND the supporters. The former are often conservatives and the latter are often socialists as the BBC is a marxist organisation. Just ignore both sides of these comments. (I am neither).

    However my main point is, from reading the above, that there are no competent companies in the telecommunications field. As a technical journalist who has had a lot of experience with these companies, I can agree with most laments here.

    Report on 30 December 2008  |  Love thisLove  0 loves

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